Fireball's friendly fire Suggestion (in General)
Well here goes my thoughts on the damage inflicted to your own minions in melee from your own fireballs:
I think that the friendly fire should affect your minions that wield a weapon and are truly engaged in melee combat. I can see how fireballs directed to their foes could hurt your melee combatant.
But, if your minion is not wielding a weapon or doesn't have UC trained, I would expect that he would not be close up in melee combat, but rather running away--lol. Or, he could be at a distance firing fireballs himself, or even arrows. But, on the other hand, he IS getting hurt in melee, so I can see the contrarian point there. Maybe if your minion doesn't wield a weapon in melee, it should be given some evasion boost--I don't know but I hope you understand what I'm getting at.
Anyway, I think the friendly fire damage in melee is a little too much, and it could be tweaked some.
Umm, I guess evasion wouldn't help friendly fire damage, but Endurance would.
July 13 2005 3:25 PM EDT
That's how I thought it worked when I got here, but you know you can't do this without changing something else about FB.
July 13 2005 3:26 PM EDT
if the mage is good enough to hit his enemy in ranged (all of them at that) why cant he avoid the guy standing right next to him? :S
July 13 2005 3:28 PM EDT
splash damage? the idea of a fireball is not exactly precision, IMO : )
hmmm, or maybe not hit the friedly minion standing behind him.
July 13 2005 3:46 PM EDT
that does make slightly more sense, but that minion stading behind him might also be in front of him, hacking away at the tagets of said fireball...
sounds like a conundrum!
Yes, but the point is if he's not wielding a wepon or doesn't have UC trained, that minion wouldn't be hacking at anyone.
why would we need to BOOST FB anymore lol
July 13 2005 4:04 PM EDT
it seems like anything akin to applying logic to the way CB works is futile. to make the way splash damage works make sense, you would have to make to many checks each time FB is cast in melee, and it seems that Jon has already made clear that things getting too complicated is not going to happen.
dunno about the whole idea, i think it makes as much sense as it is ever going to right now, because FB is meant to nuke everything.
I guess a possible solution would NOT to change fireball at all. But to possibly add some protection or endurance to the non-weapon yielding minion in melee, and this will mitigate some of that flash damage to a minion that's not even engaged in melee combat.
another "please make my strat better" post
or make it so FB mages could train DX to make their FB's hit more toward their enemy's and to miss their team more.
It will get rid of the whole Mages dont need STR and DX, but i think this is a good idea, it could help and hurt FB mages, cuz they would have to train DX along with FB, but it wouldnt do splash dmg.
July 13 2005 4:28 PM EDT
Methinks Jon is getting jaded.
I guess it may seem like that. But honestly, this is the first time that i've tried a dd based strat. And how can you measure issues and make suggestions without using those strats and working with the appropriate spells, etc. I'm ok with the way it is. I just think that it could be tweaked a little better, but that's just me.
July 13 2005 4:29 PM EDT
July 13 2005 5:05 PM EDT
Wait. You can make my start better Jon. Dude that would be awesome, how much CB$ to make me number one. =P
July 13 2005 5:07 PM EDT
P.S.: p/p of course
July 13 2005 5:23 PM EDT
3 rounds of ranged, 22 rounds of melee.
I keep hearing people say things like "But, if your minion is not wielding a weapon or doesn't have UC trained, I would expect that he would not be close up in melee combat, but rather running away--lol."
That's now what melee is. He's firing off spells while dodging a sword.
Suppose the minion is not firing spells, wielding any weapons or fighting bare-fisted--in fact he's hiding behind his fireball-flinging mage scared to death!
While your idea may or may not have merit on its own, trying to marry a virtual fantasy online role playing game, one based on spells and magic items, to realism seems sort of silly to me.
Maybe there is an evil fire spirit that inhabits the CB world, who enjoys watching people burn so much he magically transports fire to all minions who dare to enter into the arena while melee is occuring. The reason it doesn't happen in ranged is a magical air spirit owns ranged rounds and makes sure that the fire doesn't get out of hand, but once you get into melee the fire guy rules and burns everyone (except the guy who was kind enough to add fire to the fray).
I mean seriously folks this stuff is not real to begin with :)
Ok, I concede. If the majority think the fireball flash damage in melee is reasonable, then there's nothing more to say. It's not a huge issue for me at all. It's just something I recently noticed since moving to a fireball based strat. Ouch.
July 13 2005 5:58 PM EDT
There are plenty of strategies for avoiding or reducing Fireball splash damage: ToE, MgS, TBF, and just plain adding +'s to equipment.
My mage has a very strong fireball with a ToE (that also affects my tank), and my tank has an MgS. My fireball might hit opponents for, say, 120k, and my tank only takes 2k damage. I'd say that's a pretty effective strategy.
There's no question that strats can minimize the splash damage. But, since I can only point to my own experience, I look at my Enchanter/Wall and my FF. And I wonder why my wall should take splash damage from my FF. It doesn't seem quite fair. Walls should be immune in order to give the wall minion a much needed boost. That's my opinion. I'm not going to use a "realism" analogy anymore because that's not where I'm coming from--it was an attempt at humor. lol
There is a case for reducing or abolishing the Freindly FB 'splash' though. At the start of CB1 it was *possible* although expensive to protect an entire 4 minion team from any FB splash by purchasing 3 CBF s.
With a TBF being the only way to reduce this 'splash' damage now, that is no longer an option.
It would be fairer / more ballanced to either allow the TBF FB protection to apply to all minions, or reduce/negate FB s firendly 'splash'.
Or bring back CBF s! O_O
Did I just say that....
July 13 2005 7:50 PM EDT
Yeah, if a ToE helps all minions, then why not a TBF? Sounds reasonable.
From spell/skill description page;
"Powerful ranged spell, but beware: unprotected friendly Minions will take half damage during melee rounds"
All minions are now unprotected bar the possible one that might wear the underwhelming TBF.
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