ToE and AMF backlash reduction. (in General)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 15 2005 5:23 AM EDT

Hi All, I wondered if it was possible to glean some information about ToE s endurance reduction by looking at the fixed damage I took from AMF backlashes.

First, my stats. My ToE is level 242,770. My CoC: 446,534 (99,273)

I recorded the backlash from one fight without my ToE to make sure I had the backlash formula correct.

Facing a 0.28 AMF I took (55,592) as damage. So;

99,273 x 5 x 0.40 x 0.28 = 55,592.88

Close enough for me. :)

Here are the results for some different AMF values with my ToE

AMF% Backlash Non ToE Damage Reduced by
0.07 (3,475) (13,898) 75%
0.18 (23,157) (35,738) 35.2%
0.26 (39,040) (51,621) 24.4%
0.28 (43,011) (55,592) 22.63%

So far, all I can gather from this, is that 13,898 is enough to hit the ToE’s 75% cap and 35,738 is well above it.


Grim Reaper August 17 2005 1:54 AM EDT

now go figure out the formula for what toe level is needed to hit 75% dmg reduction :)

And I don't get what you posted here, u put that toe is not included in dmg reduction yet u saying it is, kind of makes no sense for me.

[T]Vestax August 17 2005 2:03 AM EDT

Well, it made perfect sense to me. Seems like your getting 12.5k in damage reduction from AMF backlash, except in the case when the reduction would be over the 75% cap. This makes the ToE a flat reduction for AMF damage. Question is, does it work differently for different types of damage?

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 3:41 AM EDT


I missed the woods for the trees... I didn't even consider it would be a flat reduction.

Indeed, for every reduction under the 75% cap, my ToE has reduced a flat 12,581.

This makes a ToE very bad for AMF....

Thanks Vestax!

Grim Reaper August 17 2005 3:46 AM EDT

there's nothing in that saying anything about toe stopping dmg, all it shows is how much dmg amf will cause as baclash which most people know by now anyways, if we knew the formula for what level toe allows 75% dmg reduction that be great :)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 3:55 AM EDT

Gorilla. You miss the point. Observing AMF backlash damage can work out how a ToE works.

AMF backlash damage is (bar decay) the only fixed damage in the game. All other damage has a shade of randomness to it.

Take my example above. You can see 13,898 (AMF 0.07) was under the 75% but 35,738 (AMF 0.18) was above it. All that would be needed would be to record results for AMF percents between 0.07 and 0.18 to find out where the cap lies.

This wold have to be done in the minimum amount of fights, as you wouldn't want the tattoo to level itself up.

As it is, this shows the Tattoo reducing a fixed amount of damage, for damage that is above the cap. I don't think the way a ToE works would differ between normal damage reduction and backlash damage reduction, which implies that ToE's reduction a fixed amount of damage which is also capped.

I hope this fixed amount increases as the tattoo levels, something i'll test more in a while.


AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 5:04 AM EDT

More results. Left off the percentage reduction. It's quite obvious when something hit's the cap.

CoC: 453,443 (100,809)


AMF%(Actual Damage){With ToE}[Direct reduction]
0.02 (4032) --{1008}-- [3024]
0.03 (6049) --{1512}-- [4537]
0.08 (16129) --{4033}-- [12096]
0.09 (18146) --{5425}-- [12721]
0.18 (36291) --{23570}-- [12721]
0.19 (38307) --{25586}-- [12721]
0.20 (40324) --{27602}-- [12722]
0.26 (52421) --{39699} --[12722]
0.29 (58469) --{45748}-- [12721]

As you can see, the direct reduction has increased to 12721 (12722 in some cases sue to rounding) and 0.08 AM comes close to the cap.

Actually, we should be able to work back from here...

If at it's current level, the ToE reduces 12721 damage from all AMF backlashes, and the cap is 75%, that means the cap is up until 16,961. Any backlash over that amount takes full reduction, any under, is capped at 75%.

This isn't quite how I thought Endurance worked! But it makes sense.

Back to AMF. At my current level, A backlash of 16,961 is just over an AMF% of 0.08.

So, can we work out how much Direct reduction a ToE will give just from it's level?

First ToE: 242,770. Reduction: 12,581.
Second ToE: 245,370. Reduction 12,721.

Both reductions are 5.18% of the tattoo's level. :)

Whether this is a flat percentage across the board, or a curve depending on Tattoo size, people with different Size ToE's will have to help me out with that.

As for proper damage reduction, I strongly assume Endurance works in the same way, but the amount of direct reduction given by the Tattoo is increased, as I remember a changelog entry by Jon where AMF backlash reduction was reduced.

I hope this helps people understand ToE s and Endurance better! :)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 5:11 AM EDT

HTML Table testing

AMF%	Actual	Damage	With ToE	Direct reduction
0.02	4032		1008	3024
0.03	6049		1512	4537
0.08	16129		4033	12096
0.09	18146		5425	12721
0.18	36291		23570	12721
0.19	38307		25586	12721
0.20	40324		27602	12722
0.26	52421		39699	12722
0.29	58469		45748	12721

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 5:20 AM EDT

GAHH!!!!! Results slightly out for ToE percentage. Forgot mine was named... >_<

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 5:37 AM EDT

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! Got it!!


First I added the 4% named bonus to my ToE s level.

Then I purchased a level 4,070 Lesser ToE (lesser has no impact on how it works, just how quickly it gains xp...) and fought some more.

I'm not going to post my results again, but the LToE gave a direct reduction of 203/204.

The direct reductions of both my named 255,184 ToE and my new lesser 4,070 ToE gave results that rounded to 5% of the tattoos level. Actually, 203.5 is exactly 5% of 4070.

*For AMF backlash, ToE s give a direct reduction of 5% of thier level. This reduction is capped at 75% of the damage taken.*

I assume ToE s work like this normally, but the 5% of level is increased. To what, I don't know.....

QBJohnnywas August 17 2005 6:30 AM EDT

I'm not going to post details (I'll leave that to GL lol) but I tested my ToE against physical damage. Without ToE and with obviously and the results were so consistent I'm convinced I was reading it incorrectly lol. But the damage reduction worked out at a direct 10% of my tattoo's level on average.

If anybody wants to check out that figure to see if that works for them!

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 6:44 AM EDT


Right, I used the LToE versus some missile weapons damage and got the average reduction to be 4.4% of tattoo level, then tried with my named ToE versus the melee damage of a FB (I hoped DD damage would be les random than weapon damage) and got the average reduction to be 13.88% of tattoo level...

I've got both AC and Protection messing thnigs up. But don't have a better character to test with.

QBJohnnywas August 17 2005 6:52 AM EDT

I'm giving up on this - maths gives me a headache. But I got a rough percentage on my enchanter - ToE aura gave about 3% of my tatt's level. I'll leave someone else to test that!

But as a matter of interest - you don't suppose there were would be different reductions for different types of damage? Would Jon be that cruel to you GL?

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 17 2005 7:56 AM EDT

Another thing!

By what amount do tattoo's levels increase? I'll lay money they're divisible by 5.

And by whatever percentage normal damage is reduced by. 10? 15? 20?

That would give a nice whole number for direct reduction.

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