So what's with the item market? (in Off-topic)

Vaynard [Fees Dirt Cheap] November 10 2005 5:12 AM EST

Just curious to hear people's opinons on this. And please, let's keep respectful of eachother. But I just can't figure out why every single tank item has plummeted in price. Here's my theories:

1) Lack of new players: My first theory is high supply- low demand. Maybe we don't have as many seroius new players joining as we should. Maybe rares are spawning faster than serious players are joining that are needing them. I can't say too much on this, I haven't scoped New Players in ages.

2: Market saturation: On another note, I just picked up an ELB for nearly NW, and a BoTH for well under NW, and can't figure out how or why. Sure people are selling a lot, but they always have. Many sales have little or no bids- yet they offer what I consider amazing prices. Is the market that saturated? Does everyone already have their one ranged weapon, one melee weapon, armor, and is sitting happy?

3: Mage blender: Or is it truly becoming mage blender? Are we no longer in need of tank weapons because everyone wants mage gears for their new mages? The prices there have dropped much less, but still a little.

4: Price artificial inflation gone: Maybe the removing of camping and the more available nature of rares has caused this. I find it reasonable that campers, especially USD campers, kept the supply largely under control. Now released to the public, the supply is more available and thus prices have dropped.

Now my biggest question: is this really bad? On second thought, maybe price drops are good. Makes good items available for everyone. Anyone can work a little for an ELB and get it. Personally, I know this is true, but I guess I'm just a little sad my time investment here might be decreasing in value. But I guess the NUB already killed that idea.

Thanks for reading though. Feel free to comment. I'd love to hear what you guys think is responsible for our massive economy changes here.

QBJohnnywas November 10 2005 5:27 AM EST

I don't think the lower prices are a bad thing - when somebody can pick up a base Adam say for less than 100k - surely that's a good thing for the game? Bad thing if you want to make money on your rares, or a return on time investment maybe, but that's only going to affect a small portion of players. The rest are getting far more access to rares and at affordable prices. I like it...

QBJohnnywas November 10 2005 5:33 AM EST

The price drop on tank armour is not a recent thing however. If you have a choice of a ToA or an Adam there really is no choice. Body armour for tanks has been a lot cheaper in CB2 than it ever was in CB1, at least while I played.

Also, the NW/PR link means that the more upgraded weapons are not needed until you get to higher levels. And up there most of the tank teams already have decent weapons.

You've also had the changes to archery which saw a lot of tanks switch to bloodlust. Which saw a lot of them dropping ELBs in favour of axbow/exbow and morgs...

I suspect you'll see it change again in future. Mage items don't seem to be dropping that much in price, especially MCM's and Corns. It will shift again I think you can be sure of that....

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 10 2005 6:07 AM EST

1) A new palyer should play a mage for at least their bonus time. PR isn't increased, so rewards are better, armour isn't really needed when your start, and spells can do a lot of damage without the need of any cash investment.

2) Farms aren't really effective, so no one needs to hoard extra equipment for their other teams. Most people have what they need for their one main team, bar some luxury items or that elusive 4 tank team... ;)

3) Mages out perfom tanks, if the tanks haven't had a lot of investment. If you invest in weapons, use a ToA, therefore you won't use as much armour.

4) It's probably had an effect on prices, but prices were dropping anyway. CB used to be equipment intensive. But once you've got that tattoo you want, you can pretty much cruise along picking up other items on the way.

Lower prices isn't a bad thing if you're buying! ;)

LumpBot November 10 2005 7:03 AM EST

This was predicted a while ago to happen. Campers kept their camped gear (Tounge twister) if the demand was low. So they sort of kept the economy at a peak. Now with NUB giving a lot of cash and gear being sold without any consent of demand, prices have droped. I sad this a while ago, but was called a spiteful camper =\

CoolWater November 10 2005 7:26 AM EST

All of the above.

Maelstrom November 10 2005 7:26 AM EST

Yes, prices have dropped. I don't see this as a problem.

But it seems obvious that people with less knowledge of economics even than myself are attempting to make money: there are currently _five_ ELBs for auction by players, none of them with bids.

If players want to make money, wait until no other items of the same type are available. Pretty simple.

MrC [DodgingTheEvilForgeFees] November 10 2005 7:56 AM EST

A combination of 3 and 4.

4 is probably the bigger influence on it though. A lot of people back in CB1 seemed to choose to use tanks simply because NW so dramatically increased their success. All you have to do is start over with huge weapons or stop and forge for a while and you've got a very powerful char. When you make it harder for people to do this, people don't put as much importance in NW.

And the Mage Blender thingy because that's what CB2 has been so far.
It's unrealistic to say that tanks are as good as mages in CB2. The only exception is that if you're in the top 10 and don't mind wasting a lot of USD on the game, then a tank is probably best, but otherwise most people seem to have realised that running tank teams isn't nearly as effective as mage teams.

Is it really bad? Yes. If it lasts for too long. If it lasts for too long then it means that too many characters are mages and there aren't enough tanks.
But if it doesn't last too long, then it's very good. Gives a lot of people time to buy some cheap tank gear.

My prediction on the trend of low valued tank items is that we will see their prices climb again over the next 6 months. - Most likely sooner.
I doubt they'll be as valuable as they used to be, the days of a base MH selling for 10mil are just pages in CB history now. But as more people get higher PRs, they'll start to see that getting some NW behind your character wont add too much PR and should still be effective.
Unfortunately, for this to happen I think Jon will have to wake up and make a few much needed tweaks to tank strategies. But it's change month isn't it? Fingers crossed.

TrueDevil [AAA] November 10 2005 8:42 AM EST

I think price dropping is great, I really hope that the price would drop even more because to have a great tank, you need tons of money to upgrade, and you can afford getting base tank items for cheap, and then forge it yourself.

I don't see any 'good thing' about tank items being expensive, except that it's only good for people who make profit from buying tank items cheap and somehow selling them much more expensive (the previous camping system).

Mage blender, maybe but remember, in CB 1 mages couldn't compete with huge tanks (especially the ones with ELB) no matter how hard they try.

If this is about rare values of the 'rares', well it wasn't rare before either, because people can still get it as long as they have money.

maulaxe November 10 2005 9:20 AM EST

why do corns and MCMs stay up?

(hint: what is the percentage of all minions who could benefit from wearing each of these? tank gear?)

Nixon Jibfest November 10 2005 9:51 AM EST

I'll agree with Coolwater and say all of the above.

#1. I don't know the stats either but odds are, new players are probably being advised to use DD.

#2. There are currently 267 uber range items (elbow, axbow, exbow) and 407 uber melee weapons (VB, Bth, BNE, ELS,MH). How many real "active" players does CB have?

#3. I think CB has always been Mage blender in the sense that there has always been more minions than tank minions.

#4. Campers are guilty of trying to keep prices at the same prices as they were in CB1. Some did it out of USD greed. Personally, I say good riddance to them. Other campers did it to keep the game as interesting as it was in CB1 when people actually got excited about fighting to save money to one day earn a uber weapon.

I think you make a good point in saying your "time investment here might be decreasing in value." Actually, the opposite is true but your point remains. Your time investment here has inflated greatly with the decrease value of rares. What once took you 2 months to earn (in CB1 and during camping days on CB2) only takes 1-2 weeks now. Is that bad? All I know is that the excitement of owning an Elbow is gone.

WeaponX November 10 2005 10:22 AM EST

i agree with PSB

TrueDevil [AAA] November 10 2005 10:57 AM EST

You know, when I played CB 1, owning an ELB doesn't give me any excitement at all, owning the first X26 gave me a real chill and true excitement.
All I know is that If I own a x150 , +300 ELB in CB 2 right now, I'll be very excited. =)

maulaxe November 10 2005 11:04 AM EST

it's not the size that matters... it's how you use it.


TrueDevil [AAA] November 10 2005 11:14 AM EST

maulaxe, the highest scores board doesn't seem to agree with your theory. =)

Nixon Jibfest November 10 2005 11:57 AM EST

ahh.. i remember the damage of x24 elbow... then Jonathan nerfed it.
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