2 Minion Tank Strat (in General)
I was thinking of something along this line since I picked up my BoNE, but the TSA make it so much more appealing. Suggestions and improvements welcome but something like this;
1) Tank. Trains BL, HP, Str, Dex and a Base Prot. Uses a BoNE, TSA, MgS and any other god tank gear. DB, Tulks, etc.
2) Enchanter/Mage. For two reasons. EC (To help when facing a ToA Tank, can't use a ToA with a MgS so the only other option is to reduce opponents Str and Dex), and to Wear a ToE. Could train a DD, and ED (VA or GA?)
The second character gives the ToE aura to your tank (Imagine facing mages using MgS then TSA then Endurance Aura. Could even add a third enchanter for AMF if this isn't enough. The death of mages?)
The tank helps negate other tank attacks, a DD could be used to soften up the target in ranged. No missile weapon on the tank, use the full weapon allowance to bump the BoNE.
BL + BoNE, sick damage... Multiple times a round.
November 26 2005 9:32 PM EST
Skip the base protection on your tank (because of your MgS/ a simple DM of your opponent). I remember something was bad when using a 2-handed weapon and a shield. Some penalty I can't find in the wiki atm.
TSA, MgS, DB, BL = low AC. Without AMF your tank is feed for FB and MM. Without a tank your enchanter/mage is dead meat. Without HP E/M is victim to the first seeker arrow/ fireball. So your tank is alone in round two. Too much time where it can do nothing but try to catch DD and ranged damage. Here the ring closes to the low AC. Apart from that - nice strategy, good luck.
November 26 2005 9:35 PM EST
MgS is oblivious to the dex penalty poison
November 26 2005 9:45 PM EST
Yes thank you v7, that's what I mean. Neither Shades site nor the wiki contains any information about that.
I hate agreeing with people so much. Two posts in a row where I agree with people... why can't more people be stupid so I can tell them that they're wrong, and I'm right?
Unfortunately, this is an excellent idea.
Even worse, if you use this strategy, expect a score at least 2-3 times your PR. Although I'd stick to two minions if I were you, the 3rd would seriously hurt your chances against tanks.
I'd prefer sticking with two minions, I'd only consider the third AMF enchanter if for some reason the MgS + TSA + ToE didn't reduce DD damage enough. Or if people started using Decay versus me...
Poison, the base protection is a fre protection of 4 versus everyone that doesn't use DM. When using a MgS there's no reason not to train a base protection.
"Without AMF your tank is feed for FB and MM"
FB Mages are designed to take people out as quick as they can. Also, FB will be first, suffer a 30% ranged penatly for the first round, then split over two minions, then get reduced by the Full ToE on the Mage and the MgS + TSA + ToE Aura on the tank. I hardly think that makes the Tank FB/MM feed.
Even though making the second minion a Mage makes me a little more vulnerable to seekers, I'm considering making it a CoC Mage with VA as it's ED. If it doesn't last until melee, that's tought, but it's main role is as an enchanter and tattoo carrier. If it does, it get's to dish out a large CoC hit.
I was going to wait for my next NCB character to try this, but I might try changing my current NCB come payday. :D
Unless I keep the mage as FB and move him in front of the tank...
November 27 2005 6:52 AM EST
VA rather than GA. Where mage teams are concerned losing as little HP as possible should be your goal here rather than dishing out damage in the ranged rounds. Concentrate on shaving off as much of their attack as possible. Especially my favourite the FB/FF combo. Letting both of them live to melee is key here so they help you out by hurting themselves with friendly fire. And if by that point you're actually increasing your HP rather than losing it....all the better.
So in combination with the ToE, MgS and TSA I'd consider an AMF enchanter as well. Perhaps with a decent sized protection there as well.
There is the little problem of DM to consider...perhaps this would work even better with a VA weapon...but that's just a tweak.
I considered that, But I think the biggest weapon in the game + BL would be best. I'll have VA and a Mage. So they can lower my VA with DM or lower my Mage with AMF... FB or CoC Mage?
November 27 2005 7:12 AM EST
CoC if it's ToE. FB could last into melee and work against you...
GL, for a start all of those items will be more than enough to beat mages.
Also, adding in a mage is a mistake. My opinion has always been that you should not have both mages and tanks on one team. That way you dodge either your opponent's AMF or EC, rather than taking a hit from both of them. Lowers their effective in fight PR.
Another reason to avoid the mage is because any spell will draw EXP away from your other stats. That enchanter could be made very useful, more so than the mage. If you're still looking for somewhere to put EXP after EC and VA, may I suggest HP? The way I see it, once you've got EC to a high enough level to give you the advantage against most tanks, and VA is maxed out. You then need to continue to build your edge over mages. In other words, spread their damage out for a few extra rounds.
November 27 2005 9:44 AM EST
Yep, train HP or the mage will die too soon.
I'm alos considering leaving the secodn minion as an Enchanter. Training HP, EC and VA on it.
I'll move it in front of the tank, and instead of normal enchantment items, adding heavy AC items to the ToE. MS, CML, HoD, etc. Make a little Meat Shield out of my Enchanter. Buy the Tank some more time to get to Melee and utilise the BoNE + BL.
November 27 2005 2:38 PM EST
The TSA versus high(ish) AC Adam....
I just rented a TSA (+20) and equipped it on one of my walls that normally wears a +51 Adam. The damage reduction first round was equivalent and by melee was obviously lessened the requisite amount. But the damage reduction afforded by the Adam is constant...
Now this is less of a concern when you're a tank and getting the ST bonus as well but might be worth thinking about....
"I'll move it in front of the tank, and instead of normal enchantment items, adding heavy AC items to the ToE. MS, CML, HoD, etc"
Is it just me, or do you seem to have listened a while back when I kept going on and on about heavy AC armor being good for mages? :)
I tried a heavy AC enchanter in CB1, really worked well, but then again it only casted a 2nd EC and VA. One of my other enchanters had a massive EC so I could take a penalty to the smaller one easily. And VA is usually so small that you only take a very tiny loss when combined with AC.
Your problem though is going to be whether all of that AC is going to make EC too expensive, and thus no longer cost effective.
The second problem I think you'll find is that these items all require a fair bit of NW. All up, that's another few mil that could be spent on your BoNE, I really do think that this will do more for you than AC.
November 27 2005 2:59 PM EST
The scary thing is MrC is a lot of people do listen to you! Some of my best ideas have been directly or indirectly influenced by things I remember you saying in CB1.....it's all your fault!
/me has had a two-minion tank character for about five months now...AMF+VA on the E, BoNE+BL on the tank. Works well...and I have the ToE on the tank itself.
November 27 2005 4:27 PM EST
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