Critique this mage strategy (in General)


Nerevas July 12 2006 5:43 PM EDT

1st minion: 25% hitpoints, 75% magic missile
ToE/AG/DB/Cabasset/Buckler/AoI

2nd minion: 10% hitpoints, 90% dexterity, 10,000 strength forever
MCM/EC/EB/EG/HoE/MS/AoAC + Enforcer Xbow

3rd minion: 10% Phantom Link, 90% hitpoints
TSA/SC/CML/HoD/TG/MgS/AoAC

Godpanda July 12 2006 5:45 PM EDT

and your main damage dealer has the least HP and best attack and is in the front... well... nope don't see that working, even considering the PL Wall... at least not with ToE...

QBsutekh137 July 12 2006 5:48 PM EDT

I like it. A true tank wall, a true mage wall, and the lead damage producer immune to MM from the back (I guess the PL already helps with that...)

The only critique might be for enchantments... Might want to at least consider base DM and base Protection since you have the slots for it, or you might want some AMF?

Also, any particular reason for MM over FB? Fewer GA retaliations, I suppose, and with the ToE keeping you alive longer, MM should have time to eat through opponents...

QBsutekh137 July 12 2006 5:49 PM EDT

GW, I agree, to a point. My HP and DD ratios are about 25% and 75%, but at lower levels you might want more HP on the mage. Remember, he is wearing an AoI, so tanks won't hit him, and PL should help drain off the rest, yes?

{Quitter}Gah July 12 2006 5:52 PM EDT

"and your main damage dealer has the least HP and best attack and is in the front... well... nope don't see that working, even considering the PL Wall... at least not with ToE..."

Look at the items on that minion...

And this is a nice idea to just use the exbow for dex reduction and do no damage.

th00p July 12 2006 5:53 PM EDT

exbow actually does st deduction, but ya know, same gist.

QBSefton [Black Cheetah Bazaar] July 12 2006 5:58 PM EDT

I think GW is on the right track. I would seriously consider an AS in there somewhere. If you arent going to put a Mage buster item on the tank, then maybe you should put the ToE there. The aura is good and all, but you would want your damage dealer to be the most resistant. Also without DM you will get eaten alive (tank wise atleast) by GA.

The first minion wears the AoI so that means he is ignored by all melee (except in your case seekers....) but is also front runner in the CoC explosion so I see why you were thinking ToE there, but I think you are not properly leveraging it, as in, Hi I am the most resistant, I can kill myself on AMF and GA, but you cant hit me until everyone else is dead. I would keep the most resistant seperate from the you cant see me.

I understand the why of the MCM I disagree with the reasoning, try a TSA there, about the same AC, more penalties, but magic and ST bonus...that says tank (or enchanter) to me.

I do not think I would combine the MgS and the TSA if using more than two minions, spread that magic eating goodness around if you can.

Other wise I like your reasoning, just not your ratios. I think there is a sound reasoning for the sure MM and the hopefully Tank as a dual pronged attack. The PL wall is another great minion. I like the idea of WTM (which is how I would do it)

Load the Wall with Adam heavy AC but drop the MgS on there (with heavy AC comes heavy magic pens, why not make the MgS there and learn a base protection with it)

Tank ratios are not bad if you bolster with AS, otherwise more HP less DX and you will be correct in saying to have equal DX and equal ST you will train a lot more DX than ST. Stick the AoI on the tank. Why not lever your DX. The AoI on anyone else pretty much wastes the evasion.

Then your mage which seemed fine to me. Again, I do think squeeze DM in there if your want your tank to be a serious contender.

Just a few thoughts, sorry so many of them. Also, pick and choose, Im not 100% right about all of it (no matter how often I tell my kids that I am)

QBPixel Sage July 12 2006 6:00 PM EDT

Just a comment, you may want to add a base etheral chains to a minion. That will keep PL from taking the stat blows dealt by the exbow.

{Quitter}Gah July 12 2006 6:20 PM EDT

Well higher than base EC, cause if they decide to train 1 pt in dex...

And since base EC reduces by 20 many minions would be at exactly 0, do they still absorb the stat reduction or not? (No one answered when I asked in the changelog =( oh well)

{Quitter}Gah July 12 2006 6:21 PM EDT

aaah, I mean strength oops

QBPixel Sage July 12 2006 7:02 PM EDT

I thought base EC drains 100?

{Quitter}Gah July 12 2006 7:17 PM EDT

Oh it's 50, I have 20 cause of my mage shield.. (I feel stupid)

Nerevas July 12 2006 7:22 PM EDT

Ah yes, few small changes. TSA instead of MCM on the tank (forgot it only has a 1% dex penalty. Base EC to drop 20 stat minions to 0. Base protection on the back wall.

Nerevas July 12 2006 7:32 PM EDT

I think on the tank, I don't need quite so much dex. I can achieve a mostly unhittable dex with 72% into dex, 18% into strength, and 10% into hitpoints. 10% hitpoints on the tank should still be enough to combat GA with that fairly large AC + ToE. That strength increase (plus since I will have TSA+HoE) should allow the tank to add a bit more to the team's offense without sacrificing his main objective (wreck enemy tanks' strength).

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] July 12 2006 7:51 PM EDT

I don't think you'll need the buckler on the mage. The mages AC is only for Magic damage right? CoC and FB will be spread over three minions, with whatever hits the front mage getting absorbed by the PL wall.

The ToE is for Backlash reduction and to make the Wall sturdier?

You might want to consider lowering the natural dex on the middle Tank buster and training Evasion. It's defensive dex can't be reduced by AXBows, and your PL minion won't stop stat drains. Plus the =pth will be nice since you'll be using EBs.

Nerevas July 12 2006 8:03 PM EDT

The buckler on the the mage would be to help reduce GA damage mostly..

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] July 12 2006 8:26 PM EDT

Ah. In that case you might be better served by dropping the buckler and changing the DBs to a pair of EBs. EBs will give you AC to replace your shield. :)

Nerevas July 12 2006 8:58 PM EDT

Ya, its just I don't want to be fully dominated by seeker shots. At high level without those DBs first round of ranged I could be done in by a 4-5x attack with an elven bow. I think the DBs should stay. I may or may not drop the buckler.

QBSefton [Black Cheetah Bazaar] July 12 2006 9:09 PM EDT

An Illustrious QB once told me on CB1, that armor doesn't matter on anything but tanks and walls because it cannot make a difference. At least not at the upper levels. This is true. If you want AC as in armor on your mage (not DB's corns, etc. this is not AC armor) realize it is only temporary. Pretty soon it wont make the slightestest difference, and any penalties they cause will only be a detriment at that time. Look at it like this a +10 buckler. A +10 buckler blocks 2% magic damage and like 4% physical, rough numbers. So when the damage is 1K you might literally survive because of it. When the damage is 100K, well if you are able to cut it that close you are a better player than I.

ScY July 12 2006 9:10 PM EDT

honestly: go with a tank

QBsutekh137 July 12 2006 9:57 PM EDT

Hooray for Roonie!!!!! WOOF!

Josh [Cult of the Valaraukar] July 13 2006 12:57 AM EDT

Minion 1:

Nearly perfect, maybe need a little extra HP due to AMF backlash, that has proven to be a problem for me with a big MM.

An AMF big enough to stop decay and maybe a little extra to be safe.

Minion 2:

Add evasion in place of some dex.

I don't know which would work better on this minion, DB or EB. EB would give good bonus with the big DEX, but that DEX should be rather high anyway. I kind of think DBs could help more, but I don't know if you care about this minion making it past range or long after range.

Monitor damage intake because 10% could prove a little small.

This is a minion 2 and 3 combo:

You need DM to cancel out any base GS for your exbow to to its full use. I want to suggest maybe even a bigger one thats 10k-20k for small protections and GAs but then you'd need to train EC up higher also and lose a bit of EXP on both of those minions. That would come down to your choosing, but if you think about it, 10k-20k isn't that big of a loss when you are single stat dominant anyway, your HP and DEX will still be really big.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] July 13 2006 3:49 AM EDT

Oh and always train a base Protection on a MgS minion (unless you've plumped to pump prot fully on another)! ;)
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