PR Comparison: Cesti / Tulka (in General)

AdminNightStrike July 14 2006 9:55 AM EDT

Cesti have a smaller PR weight (0.1 versus 0.15), but a larger upgrade cost than Tulka's Gauntlets. Which adds less PR per AC increase?

QBJohnnywas July 14 2006 10:02 AM EDT

If it's PR weight is less then the Cesti will add less PR. Upgrade costs within an item class get cheaper the more 'rare' an item.

AdminNightStrike July 14 2006 10:05 AM EDT

The thing is, a Pair of Cesti is more expensive with less PR weight. If what you said was true, I could wear Leather Gloves and it would have the smallest PR effect. It does not. So I'm wondering, does the cheaper upgrade curve of Tulkas' Gauntlets counteract the larger PR weight?

QBJohnnywas July 14 2006 10:11 AM EDT

The actual price of upgrades is not included in the PR weighting formula. It's all about the size of the minion, the actual number of enchantments on the item and the PR weight assigned to the item.

To be honest with you I've found a few things to do with PR weighting that I'm not sure about. :/

AdminNightStrike July 14 2006 10:16 AM EDT

Hold up. Originally, PR increased with NW no matter where it came from. Jon said numerous times that NW is NW is NW. So, a larger NW on any item gives more PR than a smaller NW on any other item.

With PR Weight, I thought the above was modified to (NW * PR Weight) is (NW * PR weight) is (NW * PR weight) such that the NW of any item, after being modified by PR weight, is equal to the PR impact of any other item's NW modified by its PR weight. If that formula works out to be the same between a large NW * small PR weight and a small NW * a large PR weight, than the PR impact is the same.

Or so I thought.

AdminNightStrike July 14 2006 10:20 AM EDT

From the Wiki:

"PR weight is an indicator of how much your PR will increase with networth when an item is equipped. This factor influences how much the armor's NW affects your PR. Increasing the NW of any piece of armor will increase the PR of the character more depending on how high the PR weight of that item is. A PR weight of N now means that for every plus of enchantment on the item, your PR will increase by N% of the xp on the minion equipping it."

Ok, so that sounds like a contradicting statement. First it says what I said in my previous post. Then, the last sentence says what you said, JW, that it's based on the enchantment plus and not NW.

bartjan July 14 2006 10:38 AM EDT

I believe it works like this: if an item has a PR weight of 0.1 and a NW of 1M, then 100,000 "XP" is added to the character, and based on that total "XP" the PR is calculated.

Just a data point, downgrading my TSA+38 to a rented +21 one did drop my PR from 1696269 to 1681243 (-15026). The NW decrease was 1736211. PR weight is 0.2
The question is (and no, I'm not going to unlearn something to test this...) if training 347,242 XP (on 1 minion) would increase my PR by 15,026?
If that's the case, then this is how the PR weight works. If not, it's something else.

AdminNightStrike July 14 2006 11:15 AM EDT

"This is very cool. PR weighting per minion.

I have 2 +8 corns. One on a minion that I have had from the beginning. It gives just over 20k to my PR. The other minion I hired 2 months ago so it has a lot less xp. Its +8 corn only gives me 6k PR.

Very very nice change."

Ranger posted that in the associated changelog thread. You might be right, bartjan.

AdminNightStrike July 14 2006 11:52 AM EDT

This is from the Wiki's Armor page (it's wrong):

"Armor that has been enchanted increases PR on a per-minion basis. The PR increase from armors higher than base is determined by the armor's PR weight and the armor's level of enchantment. Given a minion with power P, armor with enchantment N, and a PR weight of W, the adjusted power of a minion is: P * (1 + (W * N / 100))"

I just tested this with my Cesti +9. Unequipped, my PR is 914,199. Equipped, it's 916,140. The formula tells me it should be 922,426. It's way off.

bartjan July 14 2006 12:31 PM EDT

"You might be right, bartjan."

Nope, I completely forgot about the amount of XP the minion has trained. That does make a difference...

Nerevas July 15 2006 5:01 AM EDT

Nightstrike, when you did that test did you consider the PR weight is calculated for only the minion who's wearing the armor? You need to know how much of your MPR that specific minion holds in order to calculate it correctly.

Rubberduck[T] [Hell Blenders] July 15 2006 8:49 AM EDT

I'm not sure if the PR increase relates to the + or the NW now. It certainly depends on the xp in the minion wearing it. One thing to remember for your testing is that any increase in total armor nw (whole team) very slightly decreases the amount of PR added by all the rest of your armor NW, including tattoos. So if you want some absolute figures for PR added by an item to a given minion mpr you should test with the team totally naked.
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