Some people just aren't allowed to do well in clans (in General)


AvoidCXT November 6 2006 10:14 PM EST

Score
Average Clan Points Lost Weekly
100k-500k
3268
500k-1.2m
5460
1.3m-2.2m
9242
1.6m-2.1m
10356
2.3m-4m
6191


As you can see, characters in certain score ranges have a much harder time in clans than others. I believe that this is a symptom of the dead-zone problem, and I think most that inhabit this zone would agree with me. There is about 1 page of characters with pr between 1m and 2m, compared to almost 3 pages of characters 500k-1m, and about a hundred pages of everyone lower. Combine that with the relatively low percentage of dead-zone characters that are in clans, and you see that players in and above that range have few options for their favorites list. This means people get attacked by just about everyone ahead of them, making for huge losses in clan points. This is a problem that feeds itself, at least to a small degree. Lots of people in the suck spot score range get frustrated at the difficulty of keeping a positive net score, and start forging or start an NCB, which makes the dead zone deader, and everyone left gets hit harder.

I think there is a good way to make clans a little easier for those in the "suck spot", and its something that is already all over CB: a non-linear scale. Currently, net score is:

[Clan points earned fighting(CPE)] - [Clan points taken by attackers(CPT)]

What if instead, it was:

CPE - F(CPT)

Where F(CPT) is a non-linear function of CPT? For argument's sake, lets look at a few examples of what would happen if F(CPT) = 0.5*(CPT) + 30*(CPT^0.3).

Character
Score
Gross Clan Score
Net Clan Score
New Net Score
Nemesis
2,050,502
2,129
-57
734
Bamph
751,530
1,695
811
1,023
Shinji
165,047
1,487
1,015
1,060

So you get the idea, people getting hit the hardest would be helped the most by such a change, making clans a little easier for the inhabitants of the dead-zone. However, looking over those results, I don't think I came up with a very good equation. But there are nearly infinite possible equations that could be implemented, and there are plenty of examples in CB of how Jonathan can come up with good non-linear equations.

Eurynome Bartleby [Bartleby's] November 6 2006 10:55 PM EST

At least you bring forth some facts, and I am totally agreeing with the fact that something must be done about the dead zone problem, and that a new way of calculating clan scores are in order.

AdminJonathan November 6 2006 11:35 PM EST

Interesting. I think this would be a good thing to address with next month's changes.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 7 2006 3:17 AM EST

:D

Flamey November 7 2006 3:21 AM EST

holy munchkin! Go avoid!! (and, no I don't exactly understand that)

but you got jon to be interested, sweet :)

I get that it makes us lose less score :)

Miandrital November 7 2006 3:22 AM EST

Woot, I might be able rejoin my old clan!

QBJohnnywas November 7 2006 3:23 AM EST

Nice. But the dead zone for clans is all over the place, I've just started an NCB and there aren't that many clanners around my score. Infact a lot of people have had problems maintaining clan points over the past 6 months - we've had a lot of people drop out of clanning and some of those were simply because they could not maintain points due to the scarcity of opponents.

(On the plus side it does make it easier for those in clans to get a bonus...to place yourself in the bonus area requires a lot less points than it used to...you can get a bonus with four of you getting a 1000 CPs a day...10% bonus isn't unusual with such low CPs)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 7 2006 3:37 AM EST

Johnny speaks the Truth.

I've restarted a few *cough* NCBs, and for most of the time, my fightlist contains a mix of clan memebrs and non clan memebers.

At the moment, there are two clan members above my score, both of whom I can't beat.

The only chance I have to fight up to grow quickly is to look to non clan members, which will lower my CP generation.


QBJohnnywas November 7 2006 3:40 AM EST

I've got a fightlist of about 30 chars. Only two of those are clan members. My points are going to be pretty bad for a while.....I'm sitting at around 180k score.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 7 2006 3:43 AM EST

Oh! Feature request. On the Edit Opponents page, can we have an 'add non clan member close to my score' option? It's a great way of bumping your fightlist if you have an abundance of clan memebrs around you, but becomes harder if you want to automatically add non clan memebrs.

QBJohnnywas November 7 2006 4:49 AM EST

Mmm...just out of interest I've just looked to see how many clan members are ahead of me - I went through scores from 180k - 580k. There are FIVE.

Lean times ahead.....


AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 7 2006 5:17 AM EST

Ouch! >_< Oh well, that's gonna hit all of us...

Zoglog[T] [big bucks] November 7 2006 8:13 AM EST

I'm lucky in my area, I always start with 5-7 3-pointers but they start to drop out in one of 2 situations.
Firstly the odd win against me makes me decide to remove them since I am mostly here to gain points for my clan rather than fight for the top so keep fighting them would result in me giving myself some negative points on top of what I get taken off me (luckily my negatives are always really low in comparison to everyone elses).
Secondly the fluctuations in which members are 3 pointers (which is definitely a good thing) sends me down to about 2 after a few hours meaning I have to make a new list again resulting in having to fight those I can't beat again to find a list of who I can beat whose score are above my pr.
I don't mind having to take hours over my ba myself but I can definitely see the problems for the rest of my clanmantes, right now Slashundhack has scored a little over 1,800 points in the past 24 hours yet his net score is around -1,500.

Shooto November 7 2006 9:32 AM EST

The thing with not having anyone to fight at the lower levels is you also don't have very many people to farm you resulting in a net loss. In the middle is where the most active clan members are which leads to large losses in CPs from constantly fighting the same guys.

[P]Mitt November 7 2006 10:24 AM EST

Mmm...just out of interest I've just looked to see how many clan members are ahead of me - I went through scores from 180k - 580k. There are FIVE.

Ouch. And I'm probably one of the lowest of the 5.

>But nice work Avoid!

Shooto November 7 2006 11:43 AM EST

I think you're wrong about the 5 characters from 180-580k because I have 6 on my list alone and each one is between 500k and 580k.

QBJohnnywas November 7 2006 11:53 AM EST

I missed Shade's character in my round up. Infact on further investigation I missed another three. But that still adds up to less than ten clan opponents in that score range.

AdminG Beee November 7 2006 1:52 PM EST

I routinely have only between 8 and 12 players on my fight list. I think this is normal and as should be Johnny..?

QBJohnnywas November 7 2006 1:58 PM EST

I sometimes have as many as thirty on my fightlist. It's a mix normally of full bonus clanners, lower bonus clanners and non clanners who have a much higher score/pr than me that I can beat. Sometimes I only hit the first ten or so. Right now I have three clanners of any description on my entire list. Not enough for me to get good points from.....

AdminQBVerifex [Serenity In Chaos] November 7 2006 2:15 PM EST

Thanks avoid, I was going to post something similar to this earlier this week, but I figured it was just a repeat of my last post about this.

BTW: Here is my previous post about this.
This thread is closed to new posts. However, you are welcome to reference it from a new thread; link this with the html <a href="/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001wbV">Some people just aren't allowed to do well in clans</a>