Next changemonth - Fix PL (in General)


AdminNightStrike November 8 2006 6:45 PM EST

PL damage absorption is off by 1%. This makes it take way too long for backup PL minions to start taking effect. This happened right when the training effect was changed from 2x to 1.8x. What transpires as a minion is dying is the following:

Minion absorbs 10000
Minion absorbs 100
Minion absorbs 1
Minion dies.

When in reality, it should just be "Minion absorbs 10101" in one blow.

Miandrital November 8 2006 10:24 PM EST

Did the second PL start to work in the same round as the first PL minion's death before the 2x to 1.8x change? I always thought that a second PL would only start to work in the round after the first PL minion dies.

QBOddBird November 8 2006 10:49 PM EST

Heck, this often happens when you have just one PL.

It is incredibly annoying when you are trying to kill all the opponent's minions in ranged rounds, or quickly, since it causes the PL minion to stay alive with 1 HP for just that much longer.

AdminNightStrike November 8 2006 10:49 PM EST

That part is no different. However, it can take up to three rounds to kill a PL minion. When he's absorbing such small amounts of damage, those rounds are wasted. This did not occur prior to the 1.8/2 change.

AdminNightStrike November 8 2006 11:17 PM EST

Minion Imia has PL trained to 100,000, absorbing 180,000 points of damage. This is what happens once Imia's HP gets knocked down pretty far. Observe:

ember's familiar's Magic missile hit Alod [117938]
Imia absorbs damage [32257]

ember's familiar's Magic missile hit Alod [215559]
Imia absorbs damage [322]

ember's familiar's Magic missile hit Alod [117099]
Imia absorbs damage [3]

R.I.P. Imia

That's three rounds where Imia shuld have just absorbed everything in the first round and died. So for the next two rounds when someone else could have been doing the absorbing, no one was and full damage was applied.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 9 2006 3:20 AM EST

NS, To bisy at work to run the numbers (sorry!) but I tihnk that's due tot he 10% reducetion PL gives. It's not shown in the damage absorbed.

Imia can't abosrb more than s/he has HP, so absorbed 32257. But this is actually reduced to 29031, leaving imia with 3226 HP, able to absorb next round.

Or something like that. ;)

If you could post a full fight log, I could check all the numbers. ;)

AdminNightStrike November 9 2006 3:36 AM EST

No, you're correct that that's what's going on. However, it worked better initially.

AdminNightStrike November 9 2006 3:37 AM EST

What I meant to say was that it's probably due to that, but notice that the discrepancy is 1%, not 10%.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 9 2006 5:04 AM EST

NS, ran some numbers using my team. Left out the round nothing happened to my PL minion.

(W)All in One lacerated Aegis with A Mechanically Defective Pistol [12662]
Divine Shield absorbs damage [10800]

(W)All in One rived Aegis with A Mechanically Defective Pistol [15654]
Divine Shield absorbs damage [9259]

(W)All in One gashed Aegis with A Mechanically Defective Pistol [10895]
Divine Shield absorbs damage [92]

W)All in One decapitated Divine Shield with A Mechanically Defective Pistol [15956]
(W)All in One decapitated Divine Shield with A Mechanically Defective Pistol [13707]

Divine Shield has;
HP = 500 + 17,638 = 18,138
PL = 6,000 (10,800)

Finished on -29,662 HP.

1: Takes 9,720 damage, left with 8418 HP
2: Takes 8,333 damage, left with 85 HP
3: Takes 83 damage, left with 2 HP
4: Takes 29,663, left on- 29,661

Close enogh for me due to my rounding! ;)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 9 2006 5:06 AM EST

Oh and my 7AC would have had a small effect. ;)

AdminNightStrike November 9 2006 5:15 AM EST

Ok, see, in round 2, He's got 8418 HP. That means that he can absorb 9353.3 points of damage. However, he only absorbs 9259 points. There's still enough PL left to grab the extra damage, but he doesn't. This is where it breaks down.

See, instead of taking 8418 and dividing by .9 to get 9353, Jon's taking 8418 and multiplying by 1.1 to get 9259. This is why it's broken. The minion can still absorb more, but doesn't.

AdminNightStrike November 9 2006 5:18 AM EST

Following to Round 3, with 85 HP left, he can absorb 94.4 points of damage (85 / .9). However, he only absorbs 92 points (85 * 1.1) points, and is left with the difference in HP remaining (2).

This couldn't be more clearcut.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] November 9 2006 5:56 AM EST

Nice catch! ;) I thought it was my AC. ;)

Miandrital November 9 2006 6:01 AM EST

So basically, all jon needs to do is to add some ones and make it x1.11111 or so.

AdminNightStrike November 9 2006 2:05 PM EST

Yeah, or divide by .9.

AdminNightStrike November 11 2006 7:52 PM EST

Is this enough data to get fixed?

AdminNightStrike November 13 2006 10:41 PM EST

So now that Archery is fixed.........

AdminNightStrike November 24 2006 9:51 AM EST

I just want to make sure this isn't forgotten for the next bugfix week.

MissingNo November 24 2006 12:12 PM EST

I don't understand why so many small changes are made to the things that don't need balancing. PL was fine before, so why was it changed? These small changes that are made on a whim impact the game so much. Like evasion sucked before, then everyone had to have it, then now, I don't even know.

AdminNightStrike November 24 2006 1:14 PM EST

This is a bug in PL. It's not supposed to function as such.

Flamey November 25 2006 2:11 AM EST

things were broken before Op, archery was.

PL got reduced, because you could nerf VA and ax/exbow so easily with so little exp.

it was x2 the trained level, now x1.8, it still helps.

AdminNightStrike November 26 2006 11:24 AM EST

I'm not talking about the effect to level ratio. I'm talking about how instead of dividing by .9, CB multiples by 1.1, which throws the values off by 1% and creates PL minions that refuse to die.

QBOddBird November 26 2006 11:29 AM EST

NS is right. I'd like this thread to get some attention too.

AdminNightStrike November 28 2006 12:11 PM EST

Then all sign the petition below!

QBsutekh137 November 28 2006 1:51 PM EST

I am all for anything that makes PL minions die more quickly. Sign me up.

Brakke Bres [Ow man] November 28 2006 1:52 PM EST

Can i get a skill that evades PL?

AdminNightStrike November 28 2006 1:54 PM EST

Henk, this thread is about fixing a bug in PL, not feature requests.

miteke [Superheros] November 28 2006 5:13 PM EST

I'm in! Sign me up.
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