BM idea... (in General)

No, I'm not talking about Barzoo or takin' a dump... But in the Black Market, is there any reason that votes expire? Why not have it so that they never expire, that way people can vote for what they want, and at some point get an item spawn... Considering there will still be the same amount of votes used, I don't forsee a massive influx of anything outside of the odd steel Brig or Hxbow from jokers... Everything else seems like it would come in at about the same rate once averaged over a period of time...

I agree. I had wondered why exactly votes expire. Unless it's to force the community to join together in order to get an item spawned. Which doesn't always happen anyway.

yes, but if it doesn't happen then we have only ourselves to blame. the original coding would have probably been much easier without vote expirations, i would therefore assume that jon wanted it this way for a pretty good reason. if those assumptions are correct, then i don't foresee a change coming anytime soon.

"i would therefore assume that jon wanted it this way for a pretty good reason."

As did I, that's why I've been thinking this for over 12 months without posting... After all that time, I've come up with no reason... If there is one, aside from the assumption that we're supposed to "band together" to get an item that 90% of the voters won't even bid on, then I would love to know what it is. Otherwise, well... I just thought about it (while typing the word "Otherwise" earlier in this sentence.), and aside from knowing a reason (I like being knowledgeable ^_^), i don't really care about the BM or how it works...

*me and me alone votes on a corn*

good idea! i can't wait!!

This is crazy talk! If we implemented this, any single person could make a Steel Brig spawn every 18 weeks! The market will be flooded!

Seriously, though, I think that it is to regulate what gets put into the market. I don't know if the idea is to make us come together as a community for the sake of the community, but I think it may require us to come together by limiting the number of votes possible at one time (all BM voters * 2, rather than "all votes used in the BM since the last item of that sort was spawned"). It doesn't seem like it would make much of a difference at first glance, but over time, if people didn't follow the BMVG, there'd be votes building up on every item that just a few people want. There may be an MH within 10% of spawning that has been gaining votes for 3 months, and at the same time the same thing is happening with EBs, a Corn, and AoAC, and a VB. If it takes 173 votes to spawn something, and all of those votes need to happen within a 2-week period, then 30% (for example, I dunno the numbers) of the voting community need to come together to get it spawned. With un-expiring votes, a group of 5 people voting over and over week after week could spawn the same item themselves (though, admittedly, over a much longer time frame).

I'm not sure I explained that clearly. But I think the best thing I said is that the number of votes in the Black Market at one time would be able to exceed (number of voters * 2), which I think is meant to be a sort of check on the Black Market.

"and at the same time the same thing is happening with EBs, a Corn, and AoAC, and a VB."

In that case, for the next BMVG, I will be voting VB. ;)


"With un-expiring votes, a group of 5 people voting over and over week after week could spawn the same item themselves (though, admittedly, over a much longer time frame). "

It would almost be as if people could get the items they actually want into auctions with some patience ;)

Though I like the idea of removing the expiration, I can see the following reasons:

1) If you never lose your votes, things will spawn more quickly. Jon will have to recalibrate the votes needed to spawn.

2) Do you really think the BM vendor is going to produce an item just because one character nags him all the time? And if he did, the bidding would be pretty darn low. The way it is currently, only the most popular items are produced.

3) Without expirations, one person could end up accumulating 19 votes for an item just to have another person vote once and outbid him. Is that fair and fun?

4) What if a player that voted id banned or leaves the game. Should his votes count? What will it do to the bidding if he is part of a small group to vote?

5) Is this system more vulnerable to multi abuse?