Thoughts & suggestions for changemonth? (in General)

Quark December 30 2005 2:47 PM EST

Open question to all - what would you like to see? Personally I'd like the PTH on the ToA nerfed - the str and dex bonuses seem fine based on my RoE tank growth rate, but the PTH bonuses are a bit high compared to the downside on lack of armor. Maybe 1/2 of what it's at now.

And with the dd change maybe a mage staff is now in order.

Any other thoughts?

Doc [girl power] December 30 2005 2:50 PM EST

Something to add to your HP perhaps?


Adminedyit [Superheros] December 30 2005 2:52 PM EST

whats a PTH???

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 2:53 PM EST

Since its difficult for mages to win in the higher ranks (and since they've been nerfed so much), maybe something that'll help mages in the long run.

Mage nerfs:
- MgS
- Recent damage nerf

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] December 30 2005 2:53 PM EST

I'd like the increasing money tatoo.

tWIsTEd December 30 2005 2:56 PM EST

kefeck's idea sounds good :D

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 2:58 PM EST

Kefeck, its a nice idea, but it may only encourage people to create NUB accounts and use the tattoo to gain as much money as they can just to sell it off in the end.

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] December 30 2005 3:01 PM EST

Well we have a roe. The nubs can use the roe with the increased bonus and create a huge charector and then sell that off so whats the difference.

Relic December 30 2005 3:02 PM EST

The ST and DX bonuses are vital to a tank and the PTH is a way to combat mages imo. Mages with HUGE DD Spells still do massive damage and a Tank has no way to kill the mage quickly before his team dies without a bonus to PTH. Yes, my tank can hit for 100K three times in a round, but full mages at my level can hit for almost 600K per hit to my tank. Now, throw big DB's onto the mage and it becomes even harder for a tank to compete and hit the mage a bunch of times per round.

if you are comparing a ToA tank vs. RoE tank. You are not comparing apples to apples. In my mind, there is no such thing as a RoE tank. A RoE is a exp booster, it adds nothing to strategy or to the strength of a team.

With those things said, I would like to see a new Melee Skill (Berserk (similar to old BL, but with more damage and more weakness to damage taken), Counter-Attack (you counter any attack against a particular attacking minion once per round, as well as your normal attacks)) or another Ranged Weapon Class, i.e, Spear, Blow-dart gun (chance of instant kill), Grenades (mucho expensive but hurts a lot), or something like a Boomerang (knocks out your opponents Tank/DD/DD Familiar for 1 or two rounds.)

Grant December 30 2005 3:03 PM EST

The PTH bonus is the point of the ToA, especially given the recent armor changes that allow a character to get the same STR and DEX bonuses at all levels with AC damage reduction.
So no, I think nerfing it is stupid.

Pysche December 30 2005 3:08 PM EST

Reopen CB1 :)

Relic December 30 2005 3:10 PM EST

Let it go man, let it go....

YOU December 30 2005 3:12 PM EST

Need SLeep spell. Chances for Matrim to go to sleep for 8 rounds required 800k in exp :D

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] December 30 2005 3:13 PM EST

How about you can buy exp.

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 3:14 PM EST

@kefeck: Nubs can use the RoE to get more experience. If you give them a direct money increase, then it makes a BIG difference.

@matrim : Can full mages really do 600k at your level? I'm maybe half your level, and I usually do only 400-500k damage total for the entire battle. Though FB mages hit early on for 3 rounds, a tank with TSA and MgS can reduce the damage for those three rounds by a rather large percentage. By the first melee round, if a tank smashes at a mage 3 times in that round, the tank is already at an advantage, while a FB mage not only hurts the opponent, but also his allies. Plus, tanks have a LOT more items that help them out, including the new TSA that not only defends against mages, but increases strength a LOT. What do mages have? AG's and CoI, both which takes a a lot of money to upgrade past around +10.

SNK3R December 30 2005 3:14 PM EST

Buying BA = indirectly buying EXP.

Relic December 30 2005 3:15 PM EST

You are forgetting one major thing. A real tank cannot wear a TSA.

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 3:15 PM EST

@kefeck: That's what buying BA is for. Sorry, I don't mean to be picking at you, but the ideas you're throwing out are rather half-baked.

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 3:16 PM EST

@Matrim: Oh? I didn't know that. What prevents them from wearing a TSA?

Relic December 30 2005 3:18 PM EST

I tried the TSA tank route with a +50 TSA (50%) bonus to ST, I also had an EC, EG, HoE, DB's, and BoM. I could not compete against other tanks by any stretch of the imagination around me. The PTH advantage of the ToA is the entire reason to have the ToA for tanks imo.

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] December 30 2005 3:19 PM EST

here is another idea how about nubs cant cb2 for cash.

QBsutekh137 December 30 2005 3:21 PM EST

pixel, I think he is saying you can't wear a ToA and TSA at the same time, so that means the tank is not "real". I would agree.

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 3:24 PM EST

@Matrim: Ah, yes. I forgot you couldn't equip both tattoo and body armor for a second there. But the way I see it, mages have very few items that increase their strength, a lot of items opponents can use to decrease the amount of damage taken, have been recently nerfed (even by a small percentage in the upper ranks), and don't have tattoos to increase the DD damage. I've tried fighting quite a few tanks at my level before, and I've lost most of them. I feel the unbalance against mages.

Maybe I should do some more testing against tanks now :). Hope that doesn't screw over my CP.

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 3:25 PM EST

@kefeck: Then they'll just wait until after their NUB to sell it off. The only way to stop them from doing those kind of trades is to ban trading CB2 for USD as a whole, which may anger quite a few players.

MrC [DodgingTheEvilForgeFees] December 30 2005 3:26 PM EST

Matrim, no?!

Huh? Since when?

It's an excellent piece of armor for a tank.

My changemonth suggestions:
Transfer all CB1 themes to CB2. - A bit of variety is nice, and creating your own means you have to reset it every day which drives me nuts.
SoD!!! Yeah, c'mon give me my old toy back!
Some new DD spells.
I still want that tutorial updated if it hasn't been yet.

Nothing really needs to be done at this point, just make it more interesting with some unexpected additions.

Oh and by the way, we still need some CB pants.

Doc [girl power] December 30 2005 3:29 PM EST

HP Briefs???


MrC [DodgingTheEvilForgeFees] December 30 2005 3:31 PM EST

"HP Briefs???

TMDoc "

Sorry, I'm an aussie, pants=trousers here ;)

HP Briefs though... sounds good!

NSFY December 30 2005 3:52 PM EST

I suggest we get rid of it!

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 3:54 PM EST

Get rid of what? Briefs? =D

Relic December 30 2005 4:06 PM EST

Commando Blender! :P

QBPixel Sage December 30 2005 4:10 PM EST

I have a suggestion that should be rather easy to implement. When playing starcraft, you can join rooms with either /join or just /j as a shortcut. There's pretty much a shortcut for all commands, which is rather nice, especially for lazy people *points to self*.

How about some shortcuts for the chat? I could even code it if Jon doesn't want to. Java's pretty easy after all =D.

(I suggested fingerprint activation for shortcuts in chat. Freed suggested retinal activation. We should implement those in the future ;D)

SNK3R December 30 2005 4:13 PM EST

I'm not sure what Jon's current mood is towards the chat, but last time I heard (and this was a while ago), he was tempted to never mess with the chat for small things. And, well, shortcuts seem don't really seem like a need-to-have thing.

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] December 30 2005 4:20 PM EST

cb3! lol

My goodness...=P

Asian Man December 30 2005 4:21 PM EST

yes, the mage staff would balance mage/tank a little bit because mages dont rely that much on gear while tanks heavily do. plus, because usually upper rank characters are tank based.

how about a familiar that is pure HP?
well the ToJ is already something like that, but full HP familiar would create a lot of new strategies and create a little diversity.

or maybe an EO(like the reverse of AS) that when cast hurts your opponents.
100k on Cancer(cancer is the EO) does like 33k damage to
all opposing minions.

or maybe a new shield that has no negative penalties at all, but only has base AC of like 0. then there would be even more AC added to walls and mages could also have more AC.

that is all i can think of right now and im sure there are probably many things wrong with my ideas but they sound good to me.

Asian Man December 30 2005 4:23 PM EST

oh, i forgot to add that the no penalty shield should be able to be forged, duh.....

chappy [Soup Ream] December 30 2005 4:28 PM EST

one word:

tournaments :P

oh where are you Almuric?

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] December 30 2005 4:32 PM EST

Last login at December 1 2005 3:31 PM EST.

Not Here! =/

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] December 30 2005 4:52 PM EST

:) Where to start...

Evasion (and to some degree UC). Either change skill/item stacking back to how it used to be, or change the Evasion and UC 'skills' to reduce dex based cth by the same amount and in addition to the weapon based pth reduction.

BL. Either add another skill, or stick a restriction on BL. Make a reason to choose using it.

RoS. In the very least, get rid of it lowering the effect your DM has on your own AMF/EC. DM needs that penalty. Otherwise, it and the RoS get added to every team. More so than the ToA is considered top end now. Do we really want to go back to 4 minion + massive, un counterable AS teams dominating, like CB1?

Get rid of the useless items. Why are DCMs in the game?

Add in a percentage based physical damage reducer. We've got two Magic damage ones.

Change the Weapon based NW allowance so a whip using tank and a BoNE using tank (that don't go above thier allowance) don't have the same 'power' rating.

I think that's about it for now! ;)

Peter at home December 30 2005 5:08 PM EST

I am also thinking about Tournaments and don't forget that Jon was making a survey about them on 30 September (go and see the changelog).

About ToA nerf. I think Jon has it all thought out and the nerf (where ToA grants only 40% of DX) was the last one to ToA in a long time. After that he was buffing some other things to balance things out. Go through the changelog and start thinking of strategies (there are loads of them) to beat those ToA Tank strategies.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] December 30 2005 5:24 PM EST

I'm looking for a TSA nerf

Mikel December 30 2005 5:47 PM EST

GL the penalties for 4 minion teams make my HP gain from AS just about the same if I had a 3 minion team with the AS. So I don't really see it as being the Ultimate strategy.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] December 30 2005 5:58 PM EST

Mikel, back in CB1 if you had a three minion team, you were far better off buying a fourth minion and training all that minions xp into AS, than not having one (unless you went for a crazy concentration of XP route, go go single mages!). (Well, that's how I remember it, I was no CB1 vet.)

At the worst, you get a meat shield for a round.

Plus, then there's the bonus the RoS gives to the enchanter wearing it.

More HP, which have no counter bar doing damage in combat. Exactly the same as CB1.

QBRanger December 30 2005 6:19 PM EST

I would like to see on my homepage exactly how much weapon allowance I have.

[T]Vestax December 30 2005 6:50 PM EST

My wish list is in widening the array of _useful_ skills and equipment we have. I don't really want Jon to come up with new stuff however. I just would rather he worked on the weakest parts of CB2. These include but are not limited to ToBF, Evasion, and Archery. Below is a more detailed list with some suggestions. The suggestions are not the point however, the fact that I think that something needs to be done is.

1) I agree that evasion as a skill needs to be modified a bit.

2) ToBF doesn't need a buff, it needs a new mechanic all together. It carries with it an inherent problem of doing backlash only once per round _and_ not performing backlash when you dodge a hit. That is a small window for achieving max effect. Plus, what is the point of adding evasion if it works against the backlash you do?

3) I think that the archery skill should remove the ranged damage penalty when trained to 1.00.

4) AC gloves are still in need last I knew.

(strategy ftw)

Relic December 30 2005 6:51 PM EST

The weapon networth allowance would be great!

QBRanger December 30 2005 6:58 PM EST


Something I think almost all of us want, the ability to partially untrain stats/skills/spells.

Relic December 30 2005 7:25 PM EST

I would like to see a change to DM, in that it can only cancel out exactly what it is trained at. So, a DM of 200K, could only take out a total of 200K effective enchantments. Two AS Enchanters casting 200K AS's would normally be nullified with the current DM (grossly overpowered imo), with my suggested change, the DM would only take out 1 of the 2 AS Enchanters effectiveness. Because EC has the effect it does, it has a much lower effectiveness ratio vs. trained exp. DM could also work the same as EC ratio wise, but I think exp nullifying should only be exp for exp.

{CB1}Bio December 30 2005 7:28 PM EST

Maybe a Tattoo of Hardness. Completely blocks a/more than one attack kinda like a weird ToE.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] December 30 2005 8:13 PM EST

Glory, great idea about DM (it could be a variable reduced effectieness, depended on how many enchantments it's cast upon in the pre battle round), but then that would require a massive change to the RoS.

Peter at home December 30 2005 10:29 PM EST

I guess is that DM is designed exactly as it is now and it was the intention of Jon and you can count with it as a thing which will be here always and all the things around will be changed in order to bring balance if needed.

As for the un-controllable 4 minion AS teams using RoS on AS, I would say only this: HP does not kill in this game, so I am not afraid of of those teams.
As a matter of fact I would even welcome them. Those will be opponents I will always beat in long term with any strategy I will come up and play with.

Asian Man December 30 2005 11:11 PM EST

Tattoo of Hardness would be the perfect name for a familiar with full HP equaling its level.

(CB1)logan666 [Jago] December 30 2005 11:53 PM EST

How about a crossbow with vampiric attributes? Would have the same base and upgrade costs of a light crossbow so as not to be too powerful and only give a VA of .15. With it's low base, high upgrade costs, and the VA enchantment not working in ranged rounds would ensure that this would not be the end all ranged weapon of choice. Would also add a little variety in ranged choices. You can then chose to go for the high damage of the ELB, the ST/DX reduction of an Ax/Exbow, or a VAbow to counter GA damage in ranged or just add a little HP to your tank.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] December 31 2005 4:05 AM EST

Likely happenings....

another nub/ncb nerf

a larger magic penalty to the TSA, likely on order of equal to the blocked %

a ToBF buff, evasion and fire protection for all minons, no backlash.

Doc [girl power] December 31 2005 7:46 PM EST

Has anyone put thought into potions...perhaps to give a 1 hour buff or a certain amount of BA buff to stats.

Magic potions
Physical potions
HP potions.

Things like that.


Primordial December 31 2005 8:46 PM EST

Maybe have pages for the forums. What I mean is say a thread has 200 posts. That could be say 8 pages. So you don't have to scroll soo much.

Undertow December 31 2005 9:10 PM EST

Primordial: No, instead we just get slaughtered by dial up users.

Blarg December 31 2005 9:50 PM EST

BL bonus from TSA, 0.01 per +

Phrede January 1 2006 3:28 AM EST

How about an advance warning when naming expires like a system message 1 week prior to expiry - but maybe this is already in place - anybody know ?

Bmagnety January 1 2006 11:12 PM EST

random rares spawn to the stores 1 in 20

QBPixel Sage January 1 2006 11:13 PM EST

I think random rare spawning in store is something they purposely took out to get rid of farming. And 1/20 is a pretty high chance too ;)

maulaxe January 2 2006 3:37 AM EST

roughly halve the max tattoo level
each minion can wear a tattoo.
(levels from one minion's tattoo decrease the max available for the next minion)

that would sure mix things up, eh?

Vaynard [Fees Dirt Cheap] January 2 2006 4:13 AM EST

You can read all about it in my thread if you want, but here's my idea. How about new tattoos and runes that would be useful for single minions? So many of them now are encouraging large teams to use their auras, us single minion owners are feeling left out.

Bull3t F4c3 January 2 2006 2:15 PM EST

MOD, GOP, and SOD and cb1 themes

ymisodumb January 2 2006 2:26 PM EST

Keep BL effectiveness where it is, but change the display so instead of saying .75 is max, 1.00 is again. It would be less confusing, and would fit with the rest of the skills with effectiveness levels.

th00p January 2 2006 2:28 PM EST

I think BA should be tied in with the Realm you are in.
Gondor: 7 BA/refresh
Lorien: 8 BA/refresh
Rivendell: 9 BA/refresh
Shire:10 BA/refresh

This will assure that the people you are competing against and fighting will be getting the same amount of BA as you.

ymisodumb January 2 2006 2:32 PM EST

BA refresh is better off as it is, because you could have a high MPR character in the lower realms, like ilovehelokitty has with I Love You. That would require yet another NUB nerf.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] January 2 2006 2:54 PM EST


AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] January 2 2006 3:36 PM EST

ymisodumb, the BL legend is fine as it is. At max effectiveness (1/4 of Str) it gives your and extra 75% (or 0.75) damage.

If you changed it to mean 1.00 as 100% of 75%, it would just be confusing when you Str got to large and it started displaying 0.49 which would mean not an additional 49% damage, but 49% of 75%...

chappy [Soup Ream] January 6 2006 3:07 PM EST

I'd still love to see the post game stats for the opposing team .. this would help in tweaking stats .. see how many HP were left on the enemy .. see how much dex/str you are draining .. I know I have mentioned it before, but hey it's changemonth!!

th00p January 6 2006 4:40 PM EST

Eco Clan Requests There is a short thread worth looking at, about Economic clans and how under appreciated and under effective they are. Perhaps we could strengthen them a little bit by adding bigger bonuses?

Tyra January 6 2006 8:45 PM EST

I would love to have some more Statistical tools...
like seeing how much damage (average) each of my minions did in the past 24/week/month thing...
Or to see what Tatoos/Runes other chars are using (for instance in the fav-list)

Otherwise I can't tell anything cause I am still new...
But I think that RoS isn't that good an item since
the world is dominated by ToA/ToE and You won't beat
those with an RoS....

5583 days old {Gaza} January 7 2006 4:09 AM EST

I would like to see something to encourage vets to play; that doesn't require slaving your life away to. If your not NUB or NCB or Top 10 (or don't have 30 hours/day to put into CB) there really isn't anything to play for

PirateKing January 7 2006 4:55 AM EST

Well.... since suggestions are flying about here, AND because I know how much this irked Jon way back in the day: I would like Firearms and Explosives please.

Please note: I don't really want F&E... I just said that for old time's sake. :p

trigun January 7 2006 5:09 AM EST

how bout a more useful ToJ? it would be really nice to be able to equip items to it..=)

Halcyon January 7 2006 6:48 AM EST

I had thought of weapons with elements .. like flame swords, etc. Or a way you could make your own weapons .. I dunno, I'm a tard..

QBJohnnywas January 7 2006 6:51 AM EST

Something very simple: I'd like to see who named an item. As items pass through different owners I think a little namer note attached would be nice.

CoolWater January 7 2006 6:57 AM EST

How about doing something for forgers. Let the cost of blacksmith upgrade relate to the amount of % forged on and item. Say if an Item had been forged to 50%, the cost of an upgrade with blacksmith for the remaining 50% reduced by half.

[T]Vestax January 7 2006 9:10 AM EST

That would have been very handy when I couldn't find a forger to finish my CoI way back when. I had it to +13 with 80% of +14 done and there were no forgers who would take the job. BS just wasn't an option anymore because I had already given so much money away in partial forges.
This thread is closed to new posts. However, you are welcome to reference it from a new thread; link this with the html <a href="/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001eR3">Thoughts & suggestions for changemonth?</a>