$3 million "contest" CB Tournament :) (updated) (in Contests)

Yes Chad is hosting a series (hopefully) of tourneys.

What is a tourney?
A tourney is a one week contest were u start a new character usually with a tag in front of there name example [tourney1]chadder and your goal is to be the best at the object for that week. Example obtain the highest score in one weeks time. If you win you win the prize of that week, which could be anything from cash to items to characters.

How to win
Have the highest pr character

What do you win
1st place – 3 mill cb2 (i will or already have the funds)
2nd place – depends on donations
3rd place – depends on donations

Please donate money, cash, and/or characters to tourney prizes on my account

What are the Rules for tourneys?
-It is a 25k entrance fee for this tourney send to tourney prizes. When u send funds send the name of your character as a comment so I can keep track(hopefully after time I can remove after some support)
-Not allowed to create a ncb (new character bonus) character
-you are not allowed to pay people to lose to your character or any means of that kind of farming… if so disqualified (purely at my discretion)
-all tourneys start at 12.01 Monday morning server time and end at 11:59 Sunday night server time
-any breaking of the rules results in the lose of your chance to win with that character and the 25k stays with tourney prizes

Specific Rules for this tourney:
-must use the tag [tour1] (this is mostly to make it easier for me to find tourney characters
-Not allowed to use a tattoo, rune or familiar.
-Not allowed to train Decay.
-The team must consist of 3 minions. So you will have to enlist ALL 3 minions at the start of the game or be disqualified, having 4 minions means being disqualified also.
-You are allowed to have more than one character in this tourney
-You are only allowed to battle 1500 times (you can check by looking at your characters stats it will say challenged x number of people)
-a nub will get a limit of 600 fights... (nubs get 250% more exp so the ration 1 to 2.5 so 1500/2.5 = 600 so it is equal... (my math might be off lol)
-you may not use fs/wtb, other character (including your own), or auctions. items can only come from the store (basically I don’t want to see tourney characters with l33t (amazing) weapons and armor)
-you also may not have someone sell an item from auctions to the store and buy it from there.
- you may not transfer money to these characters
-networth limit of 750k

Please note any of this information can change before and during the tourney (except the prizes) Me, slayer, and lukey (and anyone who wants to help make this a success) will do our best to find any loop holes and make sure that the person that abuses it not only doesn’t win but gets carped till there head hurts : ).



you may send the 25k early but you cannot create the character till the tourney starts (most because i can't trust you guys :) )

have any questions post here... also post your transfer of the 25k

Hurrah! You can count me in on this one.

[OB]ForgeBird (BlueWater) 206.148.180.215 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 -- [tour1]OBsBaby 11:28 PM EST

-You are only allowed to battle 1500 times (you can check by looking at your characters stats it will say challenged x number of people)

So why does it last so long? If someone gets almost max ba, they can get that many battles in a day and a half.

I thought a tourney would be more of how many hits you can get in in a week.....

more strategy than the conventional If-you-are-on-more-then-you-pretty-much-have-it-in-the-bag.


Sounds great to me, considering my limited time available.

All right! I'm in. Had to use all of the transfer space for the name.
Karmic Mishap (Chao Tipper) 65.102.96.226 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 -- :Invisible Muslims 11:42 PM EST
Do we 'have' to have three minions, etm?

only having 1500 battles mean that it's not just another clickfest test...

people who can only play once a day can win a tourney, that's the whole point!

is it an extra 25k if we add another char?

NUB doesn't work like that, from what I remember, the character would have to be created before the player started in order for there to be no bonus.

smallpau1 (/\quaTeenHungerForce) 24.240.185.51 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 -- [tour1]smalls 1:39 AM EST

NUB is 149%

valiek check out wiki under nub... yes a nub is 150%.. but if u continue to read.. it is 250% more then a person at the same pr. why does jon say that because normal pr is 100%... plus the 150% gets you 250%. so the ratio of experiene gained is 1 (normal) to 2.5 (nub). thank you.. also please do not post strategies on this thanks

Updated initial post and removed replies which didn't belong here, or weren't needed anymore based on directions by chadder himself.

I'm in! And of course it will be [tour1]Infernal Misfits (but that wouldn't fit in the note).

BarzooMonkey (Dogs Of War) 64.65.211.77 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 -- Infernal Misfits 11:34 AM EST

*sigh*

OK, then just don't allow NUB characters and base it off MPR.

Oh and the bonus percent is *not* fixed at 150. It's is a variable based on increasing your rewards enough to allow you to reach 95% of the top MPR at the time you join. The later you join, the larger bonus you get, as that si the only way to catch in a fixed 4 month period. Basing a NUBplayers BA allowance for this tourny off of a 150% bonus is flawed.

in our 1500 BA, can we only fight [tour1] chars?

Chad,
"valiek check out wiki under nub... yes a nub is 150%.. but if u continue to read.. it is 250% more then a person at the same pr."

From the wiki;

"The NUB is seen as a percentage, ie 150%, which means that the rewards are 250% that of a normal character of the same Power Rating."

The number in the wiki is only an example.

NUB % is variable, so you can't really accept NUB characters imo...

It would not be wise for a NUB to play in this anyway, since they should be taking better advantage of their NUB bonus and consolidating it with one character.

Not all NUB players are obsessed with maximizing their BA:MPR gain, especially those who are not able to play often. A tournament with a limited number of battles would be perfect for such players. Also, I know there are NUB players that would love to try out a new strategies, and get a chance at winning some nice prizes.

I've got a 100k solution for one new player being legal enough to play. :P

is slightly confused... anyway join the tourney :)

is rentals legal?

Mikel:

"-you may not use fs/wtb, other character (including your own), or auctions. items can only come from the store (basically I don’t want to see tourney characters with l33t (amazing) weapons and armor) "

I think this includes rentals, but chadder might have missed that, good point made :)

yea i forgot rentals sry.

Still didn't answer rentals question. Or at least i don't see it...=P

And answer my question.... In our 1500 BA, can we only fight [tour1] chars?

I'm probably being presumptious, but I doubt you'll only be limited to fighting other [tour1] characters.

you can fight anyone you please.. sry lot of school work

What I meant was that if you had a character older then four months and who hasn't fought any battles, then you could give it away to a new player and they could compete without a NUB. The cost is a 50k transfer fee and a renaming fee, which I assume is 50k for people in Riverndell.

That aside, I have some questions which I feel need to be answered. What is a mage, tank, and enchanter according to the rules? Is a mage strictly HP and DD or can they have DX or evasion or a small enchantment? What about the CoC hybrid? If I put a weak FB on a minion with a huge AMF then is he a mage, an enchanter, or is he simply not legal? There is a lot of room for interpretation as far as I can tell.

You could just say wherever the minion has most of his xp invested, but this could be a headache for things like enchantments and spells that don't have their levels public. Personally, I would define them based on the damage they do. Mages do DD, Tanks do physical, and Enchanters can't attack. There is of course the danger that any of the above types (mages, tanks, and enchanters) could in fact be made a wall in disguise. Please make a clear cut definition of each so I can decide if I want to play at all. Thanks.

Vestax, chances of that are slim, as others would have attacked it, which would mean, exp on that char, ahead of others.

Only if the character has hired any minions, smallpau1. Besides, couldn't any existing minions simply be fired?

yea, after i posted i forgot the only way to have exp was to have minions, but yea, i guess he could just fire them, then send em off, dont know for sure tho. But not many chars are without at least one minion.

My 'Storage Bin' character is without minions or a fighting record. I rarity indeed. Then again, I did make him just for storage.

Well, Vestax, my opinion would be simply that you have what is general for a minion of that type in stats: E.G., an enchanter having a ED/EO, possibly some HP, possibly a decay or something else commonly put on an enchanter; a tank, HP/STR/DX; a mage, DD and HP and whatever enchantments commonly put on a mage. Of course you can't be sure *exactly* the stats on there, but that's the fun of being able to take advantage of unique stat strategy. Sure, give the E a base Prot and a ton of HP, make him more or less a wall.....but how much armor exactly are you gonna get on there in 700k NW with only bought items from a store? Options are a bit limited.

I dunno, doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me.

Answer him, chad. Your tourney, but that's just how it seems to me. (note where I put "my opinion" in front - that disqualifies anything I said from necessarily containing anything of import.)

What's the difference between a minion with HP, Decay, AMF and protection, and one with HP, FB, AMF and protection?

Yet one would be classed here as an enchanter, the other a mage?

ok.. enchanter - can not do any damage on its own (except for enchants that cause damage like ga). mage fo strat prusposes he can have 1 point of exp in a dd spell and whatever else. tank must have no enchants or dd spells. (all may have evasion, only a tank can have anyother of the skills

you must create the character to be part of the tourney i have no way of knowing if someone has attacked it or anything else, and im not gonna play the game well i fired all the minions, because i cant trust that.

please note thanks to shades help rules have been changed to make the tourney, easierthe significatn changes have been bolded thanks

I had some talks with chadder and together we have made a few of the rules more simple, so it would be accessible for more people.

You can see the changes written in bold in the first post of this tourney thread.

- Shade and chadder

I'm finally in DrAcO5676 (Reborn Again) 63.231.52.81 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 -- (Tour1)DrAcO 8:34 PM EST

is it still going to be based off of PR?
or should that be MPR...?

based on PR, maulaxe. I had the same question earlier. ^_^

Here's my entrance fee..can't wait for this tourney

[-Severe-] (Cha05 M4g3) 69.192.101.51 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 -- [Tour1]-Three Amigos 9:47 PM EST

maulaxe, there is a NW limit anyway so pr would be a good thing showing who could effectively use the cash they gain to get pr, so either 750k NW worth of armor to bump your pr or put it into weapons to win more fights and gain pr that way.
Nice extra strategy point.

So what is the ruling on NUB's? Just curious .. I don't wanna look through all the posts.

Take a look at this rule:

- you can transfer money to these characters

This makes money earned by fighting virtually worthless and takes away some of the strategy in my opinion. You're not bound by cash restrictions to buy the equipment you need or when to upgrade what. Just send cash to your char and buy all BA during crazy XP time. Ka-ching, that's maximizing MPR.

Perhaps an "up to" rule need be added. So, with the previous post .. correct. Only the ones with the CB$ at hand .. have a chance.

buying BA wont help that much since there is a 1500 limit for the week.

But, Zog, with a 1500 BA limit, wouldn't using 5-600 BA during crazy XP time give you an advantage over others who spend it during normal times?

It would, but give you less money for upgrades, if needed :)

Tyra ([tour1] Triple X) 130.83.244.129 [CB1]chadderbox (tourney prizes) $25000 9:09 AM EST


here it goes..

unfortunately i already fought one battle with it against one of the chars in the list of my usual char Tyra...
since it seems it was still selected though the selectfield said it was not....
I lost of course and earned 3$ and 0xp..
the 3$ are now consumed in the transfer fee.. and 100$ are left, as usual...
Char will sleep until monday morning when it suddenly awakes to fight. :)

Tyra.........


You werent supposed to make it till the tourney started.... Now others will still fight you, newbs just starting out wont know what [tour1] means, so it wont stop them from fight that char, which in turn is MORE fights for you, and more exp for you...

Zhakrin, 6:25 AM EST
But, Zog, with a 1500 BA limit, wouldn't using 5-600 BA during crazy XP time give you an advantage over others who spend it during normal times?


Shade, 7:58 AM EST
It would, but give you less money for upgrades, if needed :)

Very good point by Zhakrin.

Imagine someone with cash entering this. They transfer enough money to upgrade store bought equipment to 750K NW, then sit there until Tue/Sat Wacky XP time. They transfer over more money, enough to buy all 1500 BA in Wacky time (they build up BA over the days before wacky time if needed...).

IIRC, CB1 tourny characters didn't have wacky times, for this reason I suppose...

ok here is the deal after alttle leg work i can see transfers between characters... you guys tell me what u want me to do

I think then no transfers TO the tournament characters should be allowed, this way they start from scratch and all have the same chances, wacky exp times or not.

and Tyra's premade char?

it's retired.

Since the rules now state that you can't transfer money to tourney characters (which I agree with anyways), this is just me thinking out loud: isn't a concern over transferring money to your tourney character to buy BA kind of a moot point? If I buy BA with my main character or "bank" character, I can still use it on the tourney character, and there's no visible "transfer" involved.

I'd be more concerned with pumping money from other characters into tourney character BS upgrades, but the NW cap was defense against abusing that.

If participants are truly concerned about someone using all 1500 BA during crazy XP time, you'd have to put a rule either limiting BA usage during those times, or banning crazy times altogether. The only way to keep track of that would be to monitor the battle logs of all tourney characters for those 2 specific 6 hour time periods, on top of the "general" monitoring for the rest of the rules.

I honestly believe that to ask our volunteer organizers to have to do that would make them lose interest in keeping this going really fast, or at least I know I would. But isn't maximizing the use of that 1500 BA part of a winning strategy anyway?

Then the Tournament must be held between wendnesday and Friday
so nobody can use wacky times....

I agree with BarzooMonkey. Because you can buy BA from another character with no visible transfers, the limiting transfers rule doesn't really help here. Like he said, the NW cap stops players from BSing items to make mad PR boosts.

Just strikes me that the money-transferring rule isn't really needed anymore. =P

I just wanted to add that for me, crazy XP time is for my main character only - I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not planning on wasting crazy XP BA on a character that I'll retire in a week, no matter what the prizes are...

so how do u propose we fix this "problem"

Question: why would this be so much of a problem, wacky exp time is available at 2 times in the week, and to most if not all of the players.

if you buy BA during it, you might have an advantage, but so may somebody else...

I may have been too long-winded and confusing about it, but Shade has made my point much simpler - whether or not to use crazy time BA, or how much to use, is a decision of strategy that will change from player to player, so it shouldn't be considered a "problem" at all.

Changing tourney to Tuesday to Friday is a good solution. The pro is that xp and cash times both go out the window. The downside is that it may or may not disallow people from participating. However, I think all the people who have entered so far are steady players.

If you go along with that change then you could decide to allow transfers again if that was your only reason for making the restriction. Though I would say that 750k is a lot of NW to begin with. The only reason normal character would have that much is because of tattoos, which aren't legal for the tourney characters.

If you change the times I will be willing to send CMs to all the people who have donated and posted so far as my small contribution to the tourney. If you ask I'ld probably be willing to do this for any other changes as well.

Personally, I think MPR is a better indication of success. MPR on CB2 = PR on CB1 for starters. It also shows that the person mastered the balance between NW and MPR which is the true challenge of starting new characters. This would resolve the need for any NW cap at all in my opinion.

One more point before a decision to shorten the length (an idea which I wholeheartedly oppose) is considered - none of the individuals who made an issue of "cash transfer is bad, XP crazy time BA will be abused" in this thread has even signed up...

Here is what I think the rules should be.
Note: these are not the rules for the contest. They are just a proposal.


---

Condition For Victory

• Having the highest MPR character in the tourney.

General Tournament Rules

1. All participants must submit a 25k entrance fee to the original poster per tourney characters.
2. All entrance fees must include the name of the character in the message of the entrance fee.
3. Tourney characters are not allowed to have the New Character Bonus (NCB)
4. Tourney characters must be created after the start of the tourney. The tourney starts at Monday morning 12:01 server time.
5. Paying players to fight and lose/draw to your character is not allowed.

Specific Tourney Rules

1. Each tourney character is to be prefixed with '[tour1]'
2. Multiple tourney characters are allowed.
3. All items that are 'rare' are forbidden. This includes Familiars, Tattoos, Runes, and anything else that does not spawn in stores.
4. Training Decay is forbidden.
5. All characters are to have 3, and exactly 3, minions at the start, the end, and throughout the entire tournament.
6. There are individual restrictions on the characters themselves:
   • You must have one Mage. A Mage must have a DD spell (excluding decay). A Mage cannot have any skills other then Evasion.
   • You must have one Tank. A Tank can not train Enchantments or DD spells.
   • You must have one Enchanter. A Enchanter can not do damage directly with DD spells or physical weapons. An Enchanter must have one enchantment and can not train any Skills other then Evasion.
7. Normal characters are not allowed to be the challenger for more then 1500 battles. Characters with the New User Bonus (NUB) is restricted to 600 challenges.

*Any violation of the above rules will cause the disqualification of your character and your entrance fee will not be refunded.

---

By making the victory dependent on MPR you make use of the double edged sword that is growth work to your advantage. Otherwise, if you leave it as PR and disallow transfers then I'll just fight 1500 battles and forge with the rest of the BA on items that have the highest PR weight and win that way. An exploit I'm sure you didn't see coming.

The exclusion of any items that do not spawn in stores covers more then one of the rules you made. I made the assumption that you wanted to also exclude the usage of rare ammo.

As for the xp time thing. I personally don't care. I was just trying to be helpful. Seeing xp time as a problem is just a point-of-view.

"One more point before a decision to shorten the length (an idea which I wholeheartedly oppose) is considered - none of the individuals who made an issue of "cash transfer is bad, XP crazy time BA will be abused" in this thread has even signed up..."

BarzooMonkey, 12:36 AM EST

Perhaps an elaboration of the argument is in order. I do not oppose the use of BA during XP time per se, but there needs to be a trade-off. If you can send the 750K for the NW to your character, there's no trade-off during XP time and no need to fight at any other time.

By allowing transfers players will reach the NW max regardless at what times they fight. This means that tournament players who have the cash available have no need for money from fighting. They can focus on XP. This would encourage people to fight extra during crazy XP time, instead of making it a strategic choice. My BA costs 318 each, so it would cost me max 318*1500+750k = 1,227 mil, a decent strategy, and enough time to spend 1500 BA during XP time to have a good chance of winning 3 mil. Are you saying no-one will try such a trick?

I think this possible exploit has been handled by disallowing money transfers. Sure, you could buy BA with your other characters and spend it during crazy XP time, but the advantage would be lower, since you would have less money for NW/upgrades on your tournament character, thereby losing PR from equipment/NW. I therefore think that the length of the tournament need not be shortened because it actually makes XP and money times additional strategic choices, instead of exploits.

Thank you for elaborating, Zhakrin. I understand your point about setting up the NW "in advance", and realize now that we are in complete agreement :)

"Otherwise, if you leave it as PR and disallow transfers then I'll just fight 1500 battles and forge with the rest of the BA on items that have the highest PR weight and win that way."

O_O Did so not think of that...

Now consider someone buying XP on another of thier characters, spending it on 1500BA *on wacky XP time* on thier tourny character, then using as much BA as possible forging with the tourny character to get thier equipment up to 750K NW...

So far, you've got almost everything. My initial plan had been to create a single tank character, send money to it, fight my 1500 battles with bought BA during both exp times, then hire 2 minions to increase MPR and BS up several items until I had 750k NW.

Now, you must initially have 3 characters, and you cannot transfer money. Unless someone else had a better idea, you've pretty well taken care of the exploits. Buying BA, as well as when you do it, is a strategic option.

No money transfers + PR based victory = forging exploit

Clearly you didn't read that comment of mine if you are still pushing for no money transfers.

Um...have you ever *tried* forging with a character of 10k MPR or below?

yes.

If someone is really willing to sit there and forge for that long to get their Heaume up a point, kudos for them. Everyone else can forge their items as well. Its equal opportunity.

I'm not playing then. The game reduces itself to a clicking contest spite all efforts to make it a strategic contest of wits.

That's what this game seems to amount to in every aspect. At the same time, unless something else is done, there's always a way to give yourself an advantage by being in front of that glowing moniter more often. You could be sitting here waiting longer to buy a higher base weapon for your tank, or inspecting every opponent before the battle begins and calculating his stats vs. yours to make sure you win every single fight.


My point? You can't get around it being a clicking contest, though you can make it judged more upon wit and strategy. Someone's not going to gain very much PR through forging, but it still does give them an extra advantage.


On a side note, I suggested from the very beginning that it be based off of MPR.

I guess I will be withdrawing from the tourney then...
*sigh*

That's good OB. It should have been MPR from the beginning. However, you are underestimating the 10k and under forger. Sure, they don't forge fast enough to reach the 750k cap within a week. But sure could come real close.

That's sort of the problem as well. The NW cap is ridiculously high. No character will ever be able to achieve it without a money transfer (particularly without a tattoo). This makes an actual cap on NW non-existent. It's just not there.

There are multiple solutions at this point.

1) Lower the cap to 100k.
2) Base victory on MPR.
3) Allow money transfers again.

The first solution is just a patch on the problem, but it should work. Number two is my pick. It brings NW management back into play as well as ignoring the efforts of a player to forge up their gear after have made all their challenges. The only issue would be forging pre-challenges. But then NW management comes back into play. The third opens up exploits mentioned before so it really isn't a solution. Yet, I feel that if you do number two then you can do number three and forget a NW cap completely without any worries.

Also, if we have a NUB that can only fight 600 battles, his effectiveness in the forge will be much higher than that of a non-NUB person who decides to forge.

as much as i would hate to do this i am cancelling the tourney, there was not enough competitor to make it worth the while (11). I am really sorry for eveyone interested in this and sorry for creating a false hype.. I would like to thank OB, Shade, slayer333, and anyone else that offered and helpme me try to make this a succes... as for entrance fees and donations i will send them back after the superbowl... sorry again

So what happens if someone fights that character too much (on accident or on purpose) so that a significant XP gain is givien? Is that legal/fair?

kent no more tourney dont worry about it being fair or not...

I thought this would happen. The instant things seem complicated someone always backs down. If you won't carry out your dream then I will.

I will hold chadder's tournament instead with only a slight change in rules. Namely the winner will be judged on MPR. I will have to develop the funds to pay the winner over time I suppose in order to match the 3 million that chadder offered.

Look for the thread as it will be up as soon as I can.

for the record i canceled this tourney becaus of the amount of competitors...i set a number (20) before the tourney started... my really goal here was to have enough people to convince jon to bring it back so as you see my goal was far from reached, apparently it was the right decision to take away tourneys... thanks vestax... i really enjoyed all of your posts also...

I'm sorry for misunderstanding. I can understand how disheartened you must feel that things did not go as you had hoped. However, that usually how things go.

Not meeting your goals, though, is no reason in my mind to let down those that were willing to play. I will do what I can to give these too few people the contest they wanted to play. I only regret that as an administrator I will not be able to play myself.

Just because we ran into problems doesn't mean we should have tourneys...
Jon could have solved the problems we had, and improved on the concept of tourneys alltogether. I don't think he has the time, or maybe just not the inclination. I'm hopeful at some point someone with the ability will attempt to contribute the code for tourneys here.

Personally I'd like to see real clanfights before tourneys, but that's my old bad idea anyway...pm me to find out more.

I also want to note that my grammar is absolutely horrible today and I'm simply not proof reading myself. I apologize sincerely for this.

Its just the NUB, we really had no idea how to go about a tourney with the NUB chars... but i think the 600 BA limit is good, 1500 / 2.5.

I'm sure the first tourney on cb1 didnt go smoothly either.

^_^ I'd like to congratulate smallpau1 on unofficially having won the first tournament, though it isn't over yet by any means. Congratulations! ~_^

not to pop your bubble, but this is the wrong thread :p