Dark Dreky, Angel of Death, Tyra READ THIS! (in Public Record)
March 9 2006 12:29 PM EST
I just read an email I received from Dark Dreky about TMDoc kicking without any cause.
FYI: talking about religious topics shouldn't be done in chat, TMDoc was right in kicking the people he kicked.
however he could have asked nicely before kicking though imo.
So instead of saying shame on TMDoc, say shame on us also!
well the first time i can understand but not the second 1, he kicked us again 3mins after without us doing something wrong
March 9 2006 12:43 PM EST
I didn't get that 'second part' though so i can't say anythign about it.
Have had some talks with bartjan, and he is of opinion that religious talks should be allowed unless they cause people not participating in that initial conversation to 'get involved' and make a hefty argument out of the conversation.
Imo, a lot of people have been picking on TMDoc for being the newest chat op, and that automatically triggers some sort of awareness to remove people who could be picking on you (I have seen this with myself also, so don't say 'you don't know what you are talking about')
So please try to cut him some slack, and to you TMDoc, try to take it quite easy for a while, let other ops do the job while you learn from them.
If anyone has any questions, feel free to CM or PM me :)
Not that I really wanted to get mixed up in this thread.
I never kick without provocation.
Its never personal...just doing my job.
If I tossed you or anyone for that matter a second time..you had it coming.<--just be thankful I am patient.
Most people think its a great deal of fun being an OP....and easy. Lol its not.
I asked G_Beee last night as he was the one that promoted me...Either you see me as an internet friend...or you hate me.
If G did not have faith in my abilities he would not have offered the position.
Now...with that said. Behave yourselves. Then we dont run into problems and I stop looking like the bad guy and looking for the bad guy.
March 9 2006 1:36 PM EST
Honestly, I got back to new players, i heard about god and I put in my 2 cents, then AoD and Dreky where kicked all of a sudden, I was going like wth ? , and then I was kicked too...
Big suprise for me, it was a normal conversation. I really have the feeling that TMDoc is using his power to fulfill his needs to punish ppl he doesnt like. I remember him being a nice guy, but then one day he was all pushy and bossy. So it comes to me with a big surprise anyone could make him an OP. OP should not just what they have to do, they should also be polite and friendly, answer questions. NOt just hanging around in chat waiting for someone to behave SLIGHTLY against the RULES, and then kick him.
As I read his reply , I don't think he is capable of doing the OP Job. I'm very happy with Shade, bartjan , Geebee... thought they were giving me sometimes a hard time too, but they were always polite, told me when I was spamming too much or anything, and then I would stop. If not I would be kicked, and that was ok. But not the way TMDoc did it. I don't know why he has such antipathy against me now, but I pretty much know that those were involved....
When they were removed, you replied to me with your 2 cents again. WTH is what you replied...you were then removed.
I had no intensions on removing you from chat.
Like I said..nothing personal. But you seem to be making it that way.
TMDoc is a nice guy, I have not seen him misuse his op powers before.
Tyra, I have to admit, you are quite annoying sometimes in chat, along with a bunch of other people. Don't forget that a kick can and normally is the warning. It lets those people calm down before talking to them. I for one am very patient, but there are just some things that are an instant kick or kill just because. Maybe if you tried talking to TMDoc in PM, he would have explained something more clearly to you or the others. Dark Dreky, this goes for you as well. Just because you got kicked, doesnt mean you should go and make a huge deal about, and tell the first admin/subadmin that you see. You have been kicked before, why did you not do or say anything about those times. I think you guys are just picking on TMDoc. Leave it alone, and behave then you guys wont have a problem anymore
i did see him go on a kicking spree, but i dont remember what was going on in chat, but i dont really think it was kick worthy if i remember correctly.
3 people is the most I have done at any time...they are listed here.
2 people yes. Can you guess why?
Takes 2 people to tango.
People get kicked for arguing. They take it quite personal if you only remove one and not the other.
I really like it when people point out things with virtually no facts.
I even had people PM me after someone was removed...it was not until they read the chat higher up that they understood why someone was removed.
Let me and the other OP's do our jobs.
If you get caught for speeding in your car...do you get mad at the Policeman? Or actually blame the person that does deserve it?
Now if someone replies about not having a license and cannot get the analogy because of it...See you in chat :P
I just brought it up because i remember it happening, i have no facts because i dont remember what was said, i just remember it was not kick worthy in my eyes. And yes, i even joined a different room just to scroll up to see what was said in chat, and it was nothing to be kicked over. Even if i said it was factual, most people would say i made it up anyway, if they didnt believe it could be true.
March 9 2006 2:43 PM EST
Why is this a public conversation?
If TMDoc does something wrong an admin will take care of it, not the bandwagoneers.
The complaint was filed in private, via email. It should have remained private with the parties involved.
TMDoc, stop defending yourself. There is no need, simply ignore those who try to call you out and get under your skin. Those are the people you will grow to /ignore anyhow.
March 9 2006 2:46 PM EST
Those are the people you will grow to /ignore anyhow.
too bad we (ops) can't /ignore people, because we'd then /ignore people who could be doing something wrong ;)
March 9 2006 2:48 PM EST
"Dark Dreky, this goes for you as well. Just because you got kicked, doesnt mean you should go and make a huge deal about, and tell the first admin/subadmin that you see. You have been kicked before, why did you not do or say anything about those times."
Hmm, weird cause I never remember being kicked before... maybe you know of an instance that I forgot about?? Anyways, I wasn't trying to be a baby and cry to the admins... I honestly felt like TMDoc was out of line. I mean I have had FAR more umm, shall I say taboo conversations in new players ( as have many others ) but I have never been booted. I guess I just felt that a warning should have been issued, I do NOT think that booting is a warning... not even a little bit.
And I did not know that religion should not be talked about in chat, I mean there were no offense statements made at all, it was quite an objective conversation. No one else had been alive in chat for awhile and I was getting bored so I started a conversation. I apologize if anyone was offended. However, I still don't know why Tyra was booted...
And Doc, yes... when I get caught speeding, I DO get mad at the police officer. :)
For the record, I tend to side with the OPs in this one. We are talking a 60 second time out from chat, here, not some massive censure. If you cannot live without CB chat for 60 seconds, get a life, get a clue, SEEK HELP!
That said, however; I would have been happy to leave this thread alone, until I read a post on the thread, which of course does get my dander up, or you would not be hearing from me.
I feel there are massive incongruities in the way CB is shall we say policed. It is these incongruities which always have and always will puzzle me. A glaring example appeared in this thread.
It was asked by someone in charge why is this a public conversation. To me that implies it should not be a public one. So on one hand, there is no community based discussion allowed when questioning the judgement of someone in power by someone without power, and yet we have, nay encourage, people to publically hunt down and find multis and then post for all the world to see. They are right lets say 90% of the time. They are however not always right. Even if you disagree with my percentage, you have to admit they are not always right. That said we have powerless people actively encouraged to post about other CB members without the power to do anything about it, perhaps ruining the reputation and gaming experience for someone, simply because a concerned user thought they looked suspicious. Hey if that is the way it is, OK by me. The not OK part is to on one hand encourage public discussion (and perhaps humiliation) on one administrative subject (i.e. the finding and removing of multis), but on the other we are unable to publically discuss a person in power and how they use that power?
That just seems WAY WAY off to me. Lets not even get into the fact that a religious discussion can very easily be a PG discussion and I can make your description of how to bake a cake controversial one when you do not include free ranged eggs in your recipe. Basically anything can be made controversial. So you say hey we have a modified PG system you must adhere to, and we enforce it. Oh and by the way there is a bunch of other stuff we might enforce, that is written nowhere, heck you cannot even get everyone in charge of enforcing them to agree on what they all are, let alone write it down.
Reminds of the hey we are a market driven economy, with entire systems and sub-systems created to make the buying and selling of goods easy, but you cannot talk about it in chat.....
Just seems inconsistent to me. That inconsistency breed mistrust. Mistrust creates a bad community environment. Follow that where ever you like.
Am I slamming anyone, NO! I think the kick whiners need to pick a different battle, a more important one. Can a person suggest this should not be publically discussed, heck yah, even more so when that person has authortiy. But, the overall picture it paints is not only revealing in my opinion, but kind of ugly.
yesterday there was another event were doc killed 2 or 3 ppl because they didnt want to move to carnage (if you dont believe me ask slayer, he was there to as an OP)
first doc was saying we all had to move to carnage then bast came she said the same then she left and said to doc do what you have to do and doc killed 2-3 players and then slayer interfered else some more were going to be killed
this is the last thing i say about this because i have better things to do then argue when you know you cant win
OP stick up to OP and if i was an OP i would do the same
sorry to everyone i offended but this is the truth as i see it
March 9 2006 4:08 PM EST
Angel of Death: that last thing you describe is some players just being in new players and making trouble, those players are asked to leave to give the real new players the chance to ask questions.
If you can't/don't leave when being asked to, you deserve a kill imo.
AOD, have to agree with TMDoc and Shade on this one. While I staunchly and wholeheartily defend your right to post in the public forum your concerns about how people use their power, in this case, I personally believe the power was wielded fairly and probably with much patience.
like i said thats the last thing i said about it, now i will watch what OP is on before i talk so i dont do anything to make him kick or kill me
AoD: Only one player was killed
Shade: Leon, the one killed, was not making trouble, just chatting. (as a side note, at the time there were no new players active in NP, as far as I can recall.)
and AoD, I would rather not get involved any further with this here in the forums.
March 9 2006 6:01 PM EST
"Why is this a public conversation?"
Because Shade made it so by posting it.
March 10 2006 5:07 AM EST
You guys, I sold my char.. I just came back for some stuff...
I was Not annoying, I joined in a short conversation,
I saw ppl getting kicked for no reason, I asked: wth ?
I see myself getting kicked too.
Doesn't make me wanna come back to chat at all...
March 10 2006 5:20 AM EST
Slayer: the thing with Leon has been dealt with and isn't part of this discussion.
Imo this thread isn't going anywhere except for more people pointing fingers so this will be my last reply to it.
This thread is closed to new posts.
However, you are welcome to reference it
from a new thread; link this with the html
<a href="/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001joy">Dark Dreky, Angel of Death, Tyra READ THIS!</a>