Lets give ROS a boost (in General)


QBRanger March 17 2007 5:08 PM EDT

I do not know about others but I personally believe the ROS DM protection is a bit too low.

I would like to see a boost up to the 40% it used to be.

IE, my ROS is 3.6M and at 25% it is only 900k protection. Yes, I realize I fight at the top and do not "know" the lower levels. But I fight plenty of DMs which overwhelm my tattoo if it were a ROS.

So, that is my belief. The ROS is underpowered and needs a buff.

I am sure there will be someone who will completely disagree, even enough to throw personal slurs at me saying I am doing this for my own benefit. Far from it as I do not use the ROS or would consider using it given my current strategy.

Of course, creative disagreement always welcome, just keep those personal bashes and slurs to yourself.

ScY March 17 2007 5:14 PM EDT

I agree, the RoS's major assets are the boost to EDs, but the thing which gave it extra 'sex appeal' was the handy dandy DM resistance.

With the current ceiling of tattoo level, and the level of DM out there... even at the 'lower levels,' the DM resistance just is not effective.

A big DM might even negate the bonus to EDs, and even take that bonus into the negative ED effectiveness levels..

And as for personal bashes and slurs, i can do that quite well enough when i am drunk ;)

th00p March 17 2007 5:14 PM EDT

I think you just want this for your personal gain *snickers*

Actually I have no idea, don't see many people using RoS so that means it's either too specific of a tattoo or it is indeed weak. But then again, JKF, HF, and RoBF are all weak, so maybe they weren't meant to be created equal?

Yukk March 17 2007 5:52 PM EDT

Well, I ditched my RoS for a RoE and I lost 1 person from my
favourites list. I soon gained them back. With a drop of 300k PR
on my 800k MPR (at that time) character, I suddenly was getting
30% extra challenge bonus.
That's with a strat designed for the RoS. So, basically, it turned
out to be worse than useless for me. It was costing me 30% of
the bonus I could have been achieving.
I've grown my character quite a bit since then and still can't really
beat anyone with my RoS that I can't beat without it. Of course, it
hasn't grown much since I stopped using it to fight, but at nearly 1M
levels, one would hope it would make some difference.

QBOddBird March 17 2007 6:16 PM EDT

My only question is this...how much DM are you thinking should be blocked? The tattoo isn't designed to nullify DM altogether, it simply protects...how much should be blocked before it is entirely unfair to those wasting experience in an enchantment that only affects what the RoS is protecting?

QBRanger March 17 2007 6:21 PM EDT

In my initial post : "I would like to see a boost up to the 40% it used to be."

With all the high level DMs floating about even the highest ROS would not protect vs even 1/2 of those DMs.

QBOddBird March 17 2007 6:28 PM EDT

40%, however, would nullify 100% of the DM trained by all but the top 3 or so DMs - and the #1 DM would be left with around 600k removed from the ED....and the RoS adds 25% of its level, or at that size around 900k extra ED.

Essentially, even against the #1 DM, you'd have an ED firing off on the RoS minion at 300k *greater* than what is trained.

That's obviously way too much DM protection, IMO, if it nullifes the stat of your opponent entirely when he is training that much DM specifically to take out ED users.

So where is the compromise? I'm back to my original question.

QBRanger March 17 2007 6:34 PM EDT

OB,

I am typing about the highest Tattoo vs the highest DM. I feel the tattoo should give some protection as a TOE or TOA or a FF does far more for battle than a ROS.

From people I chat with, who use a ROS, they state their ED spells get dispelled most of the time due to the DM's being quite high compared to the protective powers of the ROS.

As I stated, I can only see what I see and what people tell me in chat.

But remember the TOE works 100% of the time (except vs the VB which was nerfed a lot), the TOA works 100% esp the PTH it gives etc. So why should the ROS work less then that?

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] March 17 2007 6:34 PM EDT

PM wants protection from his one weakness...surprising...

QBRanger March 17 2007 6:37 PM EDT

Novice,

If you can explain how a ROS is my only weakness please do. First it was archery as my weakness, now a ROS.

But...Before you make baseless accusations like you frequently do, please elaborate on what you mean "my only weakness".

Do you really think my strategy would do better with a ROS even boosted to 40%.

Perhaps if you actually fought rather then troll the forums looking to bash me, some of us would believe you.

Flamey March 17 2007 6:47 PM EDT

novice, sorry, I don't get you.

he has more than one weakness, and I don't think at this stage, even with RoS boosted to back where it was he'd change. Take a look at his strat, ToE and High AC, he wouldn't swap all that damage reduction for what? a boost to haste.

It was initially changed for a reason, so I think hoping for 40% is wishful thinking, maybe a compromise? 30% or so.

the only thing, that I *see* get dispelled at most is my VA, approximately 200k in level. My RoS is about 1.25 mil. When I say "see" that means, I don't fight the people beating me, because more than half of them are ginormous in MPR. But I believe the DM teams fighting me, probably Dispel my AS which is of 1.6 mil level.

So, I believe that the DM protection is enough for me to not beg for a buff. I think it's enough if you're fighting a person of equal MPR or so, you do have to expect them dispelling something of yours, because the RoS' main function is the ED boost not DM protection. As it goes for farming, I believe your EDs get dispelled because they are of much greater MPR than you.

MissingNo [Battle Royale] March 17 2007 6:48 PM EDT

Not all tattoos are equal. Or else the HF, JKF, RoBF, IF would be used by more than a handful of people.

QBRanger March 17 2007 6:55 PM EDT

Certainly,

But the HF got a boost this month.

The JKF is a supporter item and is very useful early on. Later on, IMO only, it should be changed to another tattoo.

The RBF is a red headed stepchild. IF the RBF would protect vs all magic and not just FB with its melee splash fire damage, that may just make it a tattoo worth using.

The IF, well it falls into the same category as the CoC. Not very useful except perhaps as a nitch strategy, likely one we as a group have not though of yet, but Jon is laughing at our posts about how useless it is.

But IMO, the ROS does need a boost. The ED boost part of the tattoo is one part of it. The DM protection certainly is a major factor in using one. As you can use DM and AMF/EC on your own character. The DM protection is not that great. I would only be able to use a 900k DM before my AMF/EC suffers. At my level of play a higher DM is certainly needed.

But the ROS boost is my opinion. All creative criticism is welcome. Those wishing to troll, please go back to your cave.

Flamey March 17 2007 6:59 PM EDT

900k DM? is that 900k Effective DM or 900k level?

Adminedyit March 18 2007 12:10 PM EDT

OB that 40% he's asking for is 40% of the tattoo level. not just a straight 40% protection from DM.

Godpanda March 18 2007 1:14 PM EDT

Uhh.. just a quick thing... I think the RoS doesn't need much more DM resistance, just more effect in general, which helps it against DM and against all strategies. Really... the pathetic amount of hp I get from my 1.3 million RoS going into AS is annoying. Just my cent or two...

Flamey March 18 2007 4:00 PM EDT

Ablative Shield: 1,756,633/849,156 (878,326)

yeah, I agree, more than doubling my AS sucks...?

That's a 1.5 mil RoS, a named +8 corn.

Nerevas March 19 2007 1:36 PM EDT

Wow, just realized the ED boost from RoS isn't subject to Corn bonuses. That's sucky.

QBOddBird March 19 2007 1:51 PM EDT

edyit - I know it is. 40% of the tattoo level is *exactly* what I was talking about.

And Dr. Pop, I was talking about the #1 DM as well, and you can do the math same as I did - your ED trained on the minion would still cast for 300k *higher* than what is trained thanks to a RoS with that kind of silly boost on it.

"But remember the TOE works 100% of the time (except vs the VB which was nerfed a lot), the TOA works 100% esp the PTH it gives etc. So why should the ROS work less then that?"

It does work *ALL* the time. It gives a boost to the ED of the minion wearing it *ALL* the time, and it protects against a certain amount of DM *ALL* the time.

What it boils down to is this: You want RoS to boost your ED -and- make you completely immune to DM.

That is way too much, people train DM solely for the purpose of weakening or killing opponent EDs and that would make all their experience completely useless - when you train an ED, you risk that experience being DM'ed. If you could boost your AS by the RoS *and* it be completely invulnerable to even the largest DM in the game, who in the world would choose to train normal HP over AS HP? Only single/2minion teams!

I hate to be harsh about it, but the idea is too much. 40% was too much. Maybe 25% is too little, but a return to that level would put it right back at being unbalanced.

Synge [Memento Mori] March 19 2007 2:10 PM EDT

How about this: the RoS can cancel DM, but some DM will leak through even if the DM is lower than at whatever percentage the RoS is. (I guess this makes it functionally similar to the ToE.)

For example, say the RoS cancellation is raised to 50% of the level of the tatoo. So, any DM that is less than whatever level 50% of the tatoo is will be affected. But, some percentage (figuring out this percentage would be a balancing issue) of the affected DM still works. For the sake of argument, say the RoS lets 1 DM point through for every 2 points it cancels.

This way the DM would ALWAYS work (at least at some level) and the RoS would ALWAYS work (at least as some level), and both sides could be happy.

Last Gasp March 19 2007 2:47 PM EDT

"... and both sides could be happy."

An impossibility. :-)
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