RoBF (in General)


Godpanda September 26 2007 5:16 AM EDT

overpowered much??? What is? Iluvatar[NK] left the room. Iluvatar[NK] has joined the room. - carnage: Welcome back to CB, Iluvatar[NK] For some reasons Stop refreshing lol. Auctions are screwing up my CB and forcin refresh How are they screwed up? like if I click on a particular auction it doesn't take me to it and instead just screws up my CB and makes me not able to do anything so then I have to refresh Darkwalker left the room. lol in 4 possible rounds that Lochs char can do CoC damage to my RoBF wearing minion... he does none to it with his main mage... He also does none with his IF.... thats way overpowered Seriously??? Are you using Adblock? yeah yeah seriosly GW is that why? Dat sick. edyit has joined the room. - carnage: server grants op status to edyit Edyit =D 7th biggest CoC out there to and it doesnt even touch me Ablock can break random things, far as I've found. morning ;; lets try third biggest Try adding CB to the allowed list and see what happens. Adblock, even. Altair's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie for no damage two of those out of two possible coc damage rounds w/e Evening, Edy. I'll just disable Ancient_Anubis has joined the room. now I'll try biggest CoC... which should hit me full power since it is the biggest hello IA Vlad Tepes defeated Conundrum (The Knighthood) after 25 rounds of combat Rofl! Juggernaut's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie for no damage Biggest CoC out there New person on your fight list? ehmmm what did you do Oo Juggernaut's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [90374], Wulfgar [306584] Wulfgar has a +40 MGS... cattie brie has the Robf what do your other minions get for damage draco :) thats out of two possible targets at the round That's incorrect. smcs77 has joined the room. - carnage: Welcome back to CB, smcs77 sirgrail left the room. +40 MgS or not... Do you have a huge AMF? 1.2 mil level Regis cast Antimagic Field on Juggernaut (0.10) * GodwoIf shakes head WAY overpowered He should be doing a milliont to reach. and thats with a 3 mil level tat lol think of rangers tat and any spells out there i can now quit and sell out !?!?! RBF is overpowered ROFL> i have now seen it all

Godpanda September 26 2007 5:18 AM EDT

Hmmm...<DrAcO5676> overpowered much???
<GodwoIf> What is?
Iluvatar[NK] left the room.
Iluvatar[NK] has joined the room.
- carnage: Welcome back to CB, Iluvatar[NK]
<Iluvatar[NK]> For some reasons
<GodwoIf> Stop refreshing lol.
<Iluvatar[NK]> Auctions are screwing up
<Iluvatar[NK]> my CB
<Iluvatar[NK]> and forcin refresh
<GodwoIf> How are they screwed up?
<Iluvatar[NK]> like if I click on a particular auction
<Iluvatar[NK]> it doesn't take me to it
<Iluvatar[NK]> and instead just screws up my CB
<Iluvatar[NK]> and makes me not able to do anything
<Iluvatar[NK]> so then I have to refresh
Darkwalker left the room.
<DrAcO5676> lol in 4 possible rounds that Lochs char can do CoC damage to my RoBF wearing minion... he does none to it with his main mage... He also does none with his IF.... thats way overpowered
<GodwoIf> Seriously???
<InebriatedArsonist> Are you using Adblock?
<Iluvatar[NK]> yeah
<DrAcO5676> yeah seriosly GW
<Iluvatar[NK]> is that why?
<GodwoIf> Dat sick.
edyit has joined the room.
- carnage: server grants op status to edyit
<GodwoIf> Edyit =D
<DrAcO5676> 7th biggest CoC out there to and it doesnt even touch me
<InebriatedArsonist> Ablock can break random things, far as I've found.
<edyit> morning
<Iluvatar[NK]> ;;
<DrAcO5676> lets try third biggest
<InebriatedArsonist> Try adding CB to the allowed list and see what happens.
<InebriatedArsonist> Adblock, even.
<DrAcO5676> Altair's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie for no damage two of those out of two possible coc damage rounds
<Iluvatar[NK]> w/e
<InebriatedArsonist> Evening, Edy.
<Iluvatar[NK]> I'll just disable
Ancient_Anubis has joined the room.
<DrAcO5676> now I'll try biggest CoC... which should hit me full power since it is the biggest
<edyit> hello IA
<DrAcO5676> Vlad Tepes defeated Conundrum (The Knighthood) after 25 rounds of combat
<GodwoIf> Rofl!
<DrAcO5676> Juggernaut's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie for no damage Biggest CoC out there
<GodwoIf> New person on your fight list?
<Iluvatar[NK]> ehmmm
<Iluvatar[NK]> what did you do
<Iluvatar[NK]> Oo
<DrAcO5676> Juggernaut's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [90374], Wulfgar [306584] Wulfgar has a +40 MGS... cattie brie has the Robf
<edyit> what do your other minions get for damage draco :)
<DrAcO5676> thats out of two possible targets at the round
<GodwoIf> That's incorrect.
smcs77 has joined the room.
- carnage: Welcome back to CB, smcs77
sirgrail left the room.
<GodwoIf> +40 MgS or not...
<GodwoIf> Do you have a huge AMF?
<DrAcO5676> 1.2 mil level
<DrAcO5676> Regis cast Antimagic Field on Juggernaut (0.10)
* GodwoIf shakes head
<DrAcO5676> WAY overpowered
<GodwoIf> He should be doing a milliont to reach.
<DrAcO5676> and thats with a 3 mil level tat
<edyit> lol
<DrAcO5676> think of rangers tat and any spells out there
<edyit> i can now quit and sell out
<GodwoIf> !?!?!
<edyit> RBF is overpowered
<GodwoIf> ROFL>
<edyit> i have now seen it all


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QBJohnnywas September 26 2007 5:36 AM EDT

It's damage can only be lessened by AC, Endurance and Protection. It blocks FB (including friendly fire), CoC, MM and ex shot. Evasion has no effect. Guardian Angel doesn't retaliate. EC and AMF are useless against it.

What is it? The most useless tattoo in the game. ;)

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 26 2007 9:37 AM EDT

How have you gone this long without learning how to use nospellcheck tags?

Flamey September 26 2007 9:59 AM EDT

nov, the no spell check tags would've completely screwed the formatting. He would need to have put <br> at the end of every line, which isn't very fun.

Godpanda September 26 2007 10:01 AM EDT

*growls at novice* I thought it was clear that using HTML format on a length of chat didn't work so well?

Brakke Bres [Ow man] September 26 2007 10:03 AM EDT

bof even vs a 500k mpr dude with a max tat of 900k my 2 MM do didly versus that character. Why? he is wearing a RoBF, the DD damage reduction is a bit over the top.

Ragatag September 26 2007 10:07 AM EDT

bunnies can use archery, why cant you?

Brakke Bres [Ow man] September 26 2007 10:08 AM EDT

Lucifer cast Antimagic Field on MM (0.00)
Lucifer cast Antimagic Field on Decay/AS's familiar (0.07)
Lucifer cast Antimagic Field on Decay/AS (0.98)

MM takes damage from his own Magic Missile (0)!
MM's Magic Missile hit Lucifer for no damage
Decay/AS's familiar takes damage from his own Magic Missile (8920)!
Decay/AS's familiar's Magic Missile hit Lucifer for no damage


Against this character: http://www.carnageblender.com/inspect_opponent.tcl?opponent_id=95666

900k max tat with a 1.2mil robf.
My MM and my SF hit him for nothing!
This thing is way way way way way to powerful now.

Ow and @ fluffy bunny: not everyone wants to use a damn bow like everyone else.

Ragatag September 26 2007 10:11 AM EDT

of course, but why not if there is so much to complain about?

Brakke Bres [Ow man] September 26 2007 10:14 AM EDT

is that the point? the point is here is balance. And with overpowered bows we have as balance overpowered evasion. But now we have overpowered RoBF and no overpowered DD.
Bring back FoD!!!!!!!!

QBsutekh137 September 26 2007 10:18 AM EDT

Help me figure out how the RoBF damage reduction works, eh?

I fought Vlad several times. My average MM blow in ranged, between both my mage and my familiar (mage is Magic Missile: 4,621,198/3,500,908 (2,197,007), SF is a 3.2 million level junctioned with +14 AGs) is 265,000 against Wulfgar (the guy with the MgS and high AC).

In melee, I start hitting Cattie (the minion wearing the RoBF). My mage Joe? He lands MMs averaging around 700K (max ~800K, min ~450K). The SF does things like 200K, 250K, and "hits for no damage".

Very strange. First off, I don't see how my mage is hitting that hard when the largest CoC hits for no damage on occasion? Basically, I have no problem beating Vlad with a couple of wimpy MMs (wimpy compared to Conundrum's CoC). The ranged attack helps, sure, but I seem to be hitting awfully hard if the game's largest CoC does no damage.

Worse, since my big mage hits well and my familiar hits for no damage at times, I can only assume the RoBF uses some sort of thresholding again. I really dislike the overwhelm/underwhelm idea of threshold-based damage reduction. Why can't it be just a straight percentage or something? Why are we having more on/off fight dynamics added to the game again?

ANYWAY, can someone else research the damage that MM does vs CoC against the RoBF? I am starting to think that maybe there is a bug with the damage reduction against spread-fire magics because the RoBF was initially made to fight Fireball? Shot in the dark, but I don't see how I can be landing 800K MMs on Cattie.

Godpanda September 26 2007 10:19 AM EDT

Half evasion, half DM. RoBF. Unless someone has a higher MPR, they lose. EB, ECs, corn.



However, let me point out.... ToA and ToE strategies aren't any better, it's just PR instead of MPR in above statement.

QBsutekh137 September 26 2007 10:34 AM EDT

I will reiterate my point that the RoBF is still very susceptible to ranged damage, much like a ToE/melee tank or a ToE/CoC team.

Kong Ming September 26 2007 10:37 AM EDT

But absorbing all damage from DD spells seems a little too much. Maybe reduce the reduction of damage?

Eurynome Bartleby [Bartleby's] September 26 2007 10:38 AM EDT

Without any other means of DD reduction, or a large amount or HP I'd like to point out that my team gets WASTED by all kinds of Mages.

If I decided to train AMF, or even DM, or hack, HP, I'd have to drop a bit of Evasion, and then get wasted again, but by archers this time around.

It is a little too strong, but never ToA strong, sorry. Make GA retaliate, and I'd consider it balanced myself.

Eurynome Bartleby [Bartleby's] September 26 2007 10:39 AM EDT

heck*

Godpanda September 26 2007 10:39 AM EDT

I don't know, Sutekh. That's like saying ToE is susceptible. Jeesh, The RoBF is -designed- to help the equipped minion survive to melee. Evasion and spell absorption, both having greater effect during ranged (evasion from natural bonus and absorption from DD penalty in ranged)....

DrAcO5676 [The Knighthood III] September 26 2007 10:42 AM EDT

Ash... think of it this way... if you have enough AMF to reduce their DD damage low enough... your RoBF will swallow that damage whole and you will be better off for wear.

Eurynome Bartleby [Bartleby's] September 26 2007 10:46 AM EDT

To absorb sufficient damage for that to happen, I'd have to train absolutely no HP on my second minion. Even then...Maybe if my two guys were equal in EXP, I could reduce DD damage enough.

And then my Evasion would be too low to evade those gosh darned ToAs and bows.

QBRanger September 26 2007 10:54 AM EDT

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [84570], Wulfgar [359406]

In melee with a 4.77M Ice Familiar.

His other 2 minions were dead by that time.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 26 2007 10:55 AM EDT

the RoBF gives minus to hit, not evasion,
there is no bonus in ranged...

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 26 2007 11:01 AM EDT

Juggernaut's Cone of Cold hit Victor [746233], Brian Ritchie [520105], John Sparrow [417675], Gordon Gano [365981]

Noise's Magic Missile hit Gordon [486629]
Noise's Magic Missile hit John Sparrow [1095746]

Joe's Magic Missile hit Gordon [421502]
Joe's Magic Missile hit Brian Ritchie [1596802]
1.6 mil RoBF on Gordon...

Hyrule Castle September 26 2007 11:02 AM EDT

OMG GW, your text hurts my eyes :) don't be afraid to hit enter

Eurynome Bartleby [Bartleby's] September 26 2007 11:03 AM EDT

Heh, my RoBF, at 1.4 mil, (Not an enormous Tat, but still a pretty nice one) is according to Wiki, absorbing 20% of it's level by round. That's about 280000 point of damage reduced. MM hits for MUCH more than that, in almost all cases. Sometimes still hitting me for 300k damage, after the reduction.

FB does, too, in many occasions.

CoC...well CoC is already very good in the damage department, and hurts a lot.

The reduction is not as over the top as you guys make it out to be, I am sure. I am experiencing it firsthand.

QBsutekh137 September 26 2007 11:22 AM EDT

Ranger, is that usual? Do you have more examples than that one, like an average for 10 hits? That CoC damage is crazy-low. A 4.77 million CoC should hit WAY harder than 85K if my MM is hitting for 700K!

Something must be broken with the RoBF stopping spread-fire magics. A 4.77 million CoC split only two ways should be mind-bogglingly devastating, way more than my MM. Heck, my 3.2 million SF shoots for 200K most times against Cattie, so even if that were split two ways, that would be 100K damage. And CoC is WAY more powerful than MM.

QBsutekh137 September 26 2007 11:30 AM EDT

Ash, unless it is a typo, Ranger posted a CoC hit of 85K. From a 4.77 million level IF. Sorry, but if that is happening regularly, that is WAY too much damage reduction. He is hitting less than my 3.2 million SF!

QBRanger September 26 2007 11:38 AM EDT

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [428585], Wulfgar [240003]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [569653], Wulfgar [305981]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [411568], Wulfgar [248886]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [259697], Wulfgar [337535]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [285170], Wulfgar [260423]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [277442], Wulfgar [218280]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [128200], Wulfgar [398999]

Microchips's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Cattie Brie [239162], Wulfgar [365908]

Eurynome Bartleby [Bartleby's] September 26 2007 11:38 AM EDT

Well, after fighting a bit more against CoC, while it did not show earlier, (Or I was blind) it does seem that it is out of whack, probably bugged.

Though, when I look at it, without an aura, my second guys dies hecka fast and then, BANG, CoC hits me for tons and tons of ouch.

So, of course the main RoBF wearing man does not get hurt too much, but everybody else dies, still.

Atomicboy [The Knighthood] September 26 2007 12:03 PM EDT

Combined with Amf the RoBF is brutal. Edyit casts .27 amf on my mage. I never do any damage to the tat wearer throughout the whole battle. I am basically locked into having to cast against 3 minions the whole fight. One of which takes no damage every round.

QBsutekh137 September 26 2007 12:24 PM EDT

Well, it is hard to tell with the ever-so-fracking-annoying huge variance in DD damage, but Ranger's damage log still looks buggy to me for CoC. CoC should be hitting harder than that when it is coming from a 4.77 million familiar. Looks like his average hit is around 325K, which is less than HALF what my MM hits the same target with. And my MM, even with buffed gear, is only a 4.62 million level MM. A bigger CoC, spread between two targets, hitting less than half of what an MM does. That's wrong. CoC is a LOT more powerful than MM at its core, and this makes them look about even actually, makes the CoC look weaker). Unless someone can point out where I have made a mistake?

Godpanda September 26 2007 12:36 PM EDT

You haven't. CoC, even against 2 minions, should be doing at least equal damage as your MM per minion. However, depending on how the RoBF works, *shrug*. MgS always hit CoC harder (more damage, more loss, get it?), and if RoBF works same way, may not be so strange. But it shouldn't be hitting for LESS.

ScY September 26 2007 10:46 PM EDT

Hm, maybe I should point this out:

Cone of Cold: 1,311,383/2,081,561 (286,095) (on Altair)

QBsutekh137 September 26 2007 11:03 PM EDT

OK, but that doesn't explain the disparity between my 4.6 million MM and Ranger's 4.7 million level CoC, where my MM actually hits for more damage...

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 27 2007 10:51 AM EDT

I'd take a hit to DD reduction if in trade the active attack ignored the AoI like magic should...

QBRanger September 27 2007 10:53 AM EDT

Agreed Novice.

If the RBF is magical damage, why does it ignore the AOI?

Zoglog[T] [big bucks] September 27 2007 10:57 AM EDT

Jon has already stated previously that RBF damage is a seperate type of damage, neither physical nor magical so to say it should ignore the AoI on the grounds that it is magical damage is incorrect.
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