Exbow/Axbow Drain (in General)
Can we now get axbow and exbow drain changed now... I really don't want to have to switch all evasion for EC just to stop from being drained when physical damage has been changed so much...
With all the reductions every bit of strength is important as the last...
drop the drain to 4/9ths of what it was per hit... that won't solve the problem but it'll make a bit more expensive to get them to a stupid level...
September 7 2008 1:26 AM EDT
im pretty sure str still affects damage the same way it was before the change lol
September 7 2008 2:29 AM EDT
The problem is the % drain, once you get a high enough X on the weapon all you have to do is hit for one damage.
I still think that Exbow/axbow drain needs to be reworked.... its just not right that one team can use Exbow to completely nullify tanks Str and that you can't stop all hits from an Exbow even using DBs... Anyone else want to comment on this? Maybe fix it so that Ex/Ax bows can't completely nullify str... but reduces it by say 1/20th per hit or some such.... so that the X is for damage only and the + is for the pth... instead of having the Str/X tied together to equal drain....
make the drain based on damage DONE!
September 7 2008 10:09 PM EDT
uhmmm no.. I use axbows I think there fine lol.
change the % reduction to an exponential curve.
September 7 2008 10:15 PM EDT
if i were to drain someone's ST for 35k per hit. I would dump that Exbow in a heart beat.
yeah, we shouldn't change exbows because some people might not be able to use it so easily, right?
What would prevent people from using it so easily?
if it didn't completely drain str and/or dex the way it does now... for when/if you have over 4k X on it... if it only drained it by 1/20th or so per hit or base it on damage done instead it would make Exbows less of the fight changer they are now...
September 7 2008 11:51 PM EDT
drain [%] = constant * ( damage dealt / minion post-AS HP )
...where "constant" can be whatever you want it to be, from 1.00 upwards, but 2.00 would already be overkill.
Making it 1.00 would mean stats only get reduced to zero when minion is killed (unless he's wearing a TSA, in which case he could actually reach negative stats before he dies), setting it to 2.0 would mean his stats get reduced to basically nothing when half the initial XP is gone.
If needed, you may adjust the speciality crossbow damages upwards a little bit.
I think basing drain on damage done per hit would be a little more accurate.... and a little less overpowered....
no one gets my sarcasm...
September 8 2008 12:04 AM EDT
Ah I so miss the many challenges of playing a tank and things that you have to look out for. *sarcasm tag*
Even using my 141 DB to reduce FTW's hits to one a round he still hits my tank 5 times.... one is pl'ed away so 4 times and drains my tank from 2.95 mil str down to 122k in 4 hits!!!! what is wrong with this picture? Now that Exbow will just about hit every round why is it still so damn powerful?
September 8 2008 3:42 AM EDT
Have fun if he gets it to x3333. 100% drain no matter what.
September 8 2008 5:03 AM EDT
Here's an easy thing to do: make all the x drains independent.
So if an x drains 1/33%, the next x drains 1/33%... off the new total
Getting hit by a *xbow drops your stat to (1-1/33%)^x * current.
Exponential decay, which would work even better considering CTH is a DX ratio, so an Axbow adds somewhat constant CTH per drain.
Obscurans, I think it does work like that., each drain is independent and based on the dx at the time of the shot. Have patience Draco it has only been broken for 2 years :P
September 8 2008 12:29 PM EDT
It does? Well it's still pretty harsh.
I think basing it on damage done (multiply the damage done by ten?) would make them much more reasonable items...
percentage based drain will always be a problem
September 8 2008 5:07 PM EDT
^There's probably some multiplier that would work perfectly to base it off of damage done. Good solution.
September 8 2008 6:17 PM EDT
I meant each x in one single shot works independently as well. As it stands, one hit modifies stat to (1-x/33%) * current, which can well zero you out if x > 3300 (and some have done it).
With the (1-1/33%)^x * current formula, a single *xbow x3300 hit would drop you to 36.8% original stat, not a straight 0 (and don't forget constant drain).
September 9 2008 9:41 PM EDT
With the capability of 60% BTH so that now they will hit in ranged at least once I think the drain really should be based on damage.Remember it used to be you could avoid getting hit.
I think having it be 2x or 3x the damage done would be fine.Since any other solution based on weapon x and/or str creates a position where someone could just up the x for the one hit they get in ranged to guarantee a very high stat reduction.
I hope the BTH of ELB and MgsK get adjusted in the meantime.100%/99% BTH means 100%/99% CTH now
Base to hit doesn't mean guaranteed CTH. It's used to calculate CTH. If you have little to no dex, you won't be getting much in the way of CTH even if you're using an ELB.
Who has little to no Dex and uses an ELB (or one of the special X Bows...)?
If you're trying to equal a Tanks Dex, they'll get that 100% (or 55/56% for the X Bows) every ranged round.
Unless you use an AoI.
But yeah, sticking one on a 20 Dex Enchanter (assuming no EC is in play anyway) isn't going to work as well.
I sure hope there is still a change coming to these...
Bump for extended changemonth
Make them unable to do physical damage, and make the effect based on previous damage formulas... end the days of the one hit wonders!
September 30 2008 9:37 PM EDT
I think that drain based on damage would be the best option, maybe not 1 damage=1 STR drained though.
September 30 2008 11:06 PM EDT
"Base to hit doesn't mean guaranteed CTH. It's used to calculate CTH. If you have little to no dex, you won't be getting much in the way of CTH even if you're using an ELB. "
Actually, I argue that if you're using a +100 ELB with 1.0 archery and you have 20 DX, you still hit once per round even huge DX, huge evasion targets.
it's been proved otherwise... dex can reduce base chance to hit
September 30 2008 11:43 PM EDT
Actually, I was the one that said that in the first place, if you recall :)
But also, I was the one I said (in the very same thread) that I have a bad feeling in case weapon plus is involved, the calculation order breaks down and you see the above result.
Let me see if I can dig up the thread, it's not even a week old if I remember right.
September 30 2008 11:46 PM EDT
Yup, see the "eight scenarios" post in there... in particular, scenario 7 and 8.
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