Strat help (in General)


three4thsforsaken October 6 2008 10:10 PM EDT

Now that my character can go public, I could use some advice on what to train.

Currently my strat is a bizarre one, but has been working quite well. It's anything but efficient but the brute force of exp concentration is possibly it's biggest strength.

Currently it has (level, raw level, effect respectively):

Hit Points 2,201,412
Strength 25 20
Dexterity 20 20
Junction 1,430,000 1,100,000
Shocking Grasp 5,986,448 6,301,525 2,230,436 2,347,827
Antimagic Field 1,607,076 1,669,690 ? ?
Ablative Shield 5,144,297 5,319,853 2,572,158 2,659,936

With rather bizarre equips to maximize both the Hal junctioned and the large SG behind the minion.

At this point, I feel that my strat doesn't have much more potential. The few remaining targets I have either DM my AS then kill me, or have enough defense that even my SG can't pop it in 10 rounds.

I'm considering retraining SG to CoC. I'm doubtful though, but if I am convinced that the increase in efficiency will outweigh the lost of MPR, then I will. My reasoning is that, I can't afford to waste rounds with kill slots, so CoC might be the best way to go about that.

Other considerations is changing the Hal to a FF or SF. Or even switching to the RoBF, but again, doubtful if I'm going to have to retrain too much.

Equipments are incredibly challenging. I have a pair of DBs, but at this point in the game I have enough HP to tank most hits anyway, perhaps I should switch to EBs, or even SBs or BoFs. Not sure.

With about 14 million exp untrained, I'm not sure what to spend it on. SG seems like the most obvious choice, but boosting AS to overcome DM seems like a viable option too. Perhaps pumping AMF will give me the edge on all gigantor mages that are killing me.

I never thought a single minion would be so complex...

Wizard'sFirstRule October 6 2008 10:15 PM EDT

I think you are trying to go for quick kills in range rounds with the Hal, and then get lots of damage in melee with SG and stall with AS. Doing too many things at once is bad, I hear.

three4thsforsaken October 6 2008 10:22 PM EDT

The ultimate goal of the strat from the beginning was to win in about 10 rounds tops. Before I assumed that my SG would be able to one shot most people, so I wanted battles to end in about 8 rounds. The purpose of Hal was a solid way to kill a minion or two, while providing a nice amount of dex with DBs to prevent getting torn apart by an SoD or other ranged weapon.

What has happened is that Hal has single handedly destroyed the SFBMs. throughout my growth. Then once melee was hit, my strat was able to end the battle with a large SG pumping through very defensive teams.

AS was a necessary to keep Hal alive through ranged rounds to kill ranged teams. It's remarkably efficient with an AoF boosting it up.

Kefeck [BlackSmith] October 6 2008 10:26 PM EDT

kinda makes me wonder what my strat would be like with a hal.??

TheHatchetman October 6 2008 10:38 PM EDT

PK, 3 things is far from too many for a single minion... Keep in mind it's the same concept as a three minion team with each minion concentrating all of their XP on a single task. I've found that dual damage is now nearly the only way to survive at/near the top. especially without the aid of extra killslots...

3/4, go CoC and I pwn you... I am not the only one... :P Furthermore, I don't see the increased efficiency you speak of, as you'd lose higher targets, and I don't see any more you could pick up... You're going the right direction with SG ^_^

Sickone October 6 2008 10:41 PM EDT

Seems to me like you'd be much better off with BG instead of NSC.
A pair of +12 BG (which is about the absolute minimum you should consider at your MPR) would mean at least 36% additional damage in ranged (not sure if BG are also "junction bug" affected or not).

Just out of curiosity, what are the current stats on the Hal (ST/DX/PTH) and what's the average damage in ranged (per hit against low-ish AC) ?

three4thsforsaken October 6 2008 11:03 PM EDT

hmmm, is the ranged damage worth it though?

I have about 300k-500k per hit from Hal. About 4.1 mil str and 1.5mil dex (with melee penalities). 232 PTH

Sickone October 6 2008 11:15 PM EDT

Against non-evasion and low DX minions, this means you get quad, occasional quint hits (around 26 hits tops on average).
Against tanks without evasion, more like 2 hits per round (maybe even under 10 per ranged combat).

Assuming a 400k average damage, the +12 BG would mean :
* against non-evasion low DX targets, 14.1 mil instead of 10.4 mil average damage in ranged
* against non-evasion tanks of higher DX, 5.4 mil instead of 4 mil average ranged damage

You could test this last part on me - did you kill me in ranged before or not ?


No idea, to me, it sounds quite significant of a difference.
How much more damage do you have on average on the SG with the NCS on as opposed to them off ?
How many melee rounds do you usually last ?
Do you get bothered by killslots you spend 2 or 3 ranged rounds killing them, which you could clear off in 1 or 2 ranged rounds with the damage difference ?
Obviously, if the added ranged damage doesn't help you clear at least one additional target before you get in SG range, or if the SG damage drops drastically without the NSC and you usually last a good number of melee rounds, then keep the NSC... otherwise, just switch.



If you want, I could loan you my +13 unnamed BG for an hour or so (can't be that expensive for such a short transfer, can it?), so you can see the difference - just chatmail me or write in this thread when you need them (right now or in the next hour is a good time for me) :P

Sickone October 6 2008 11:19 PM EDT

An Amulet of Might [0] (+9)
A Pair of Elven Boots [10] (+24)
A Pair of Beleg's Gloves [3] (+13)

I could loan you these three pieces of gear for an hour, put them all on your junction mage to test how the Hal performs.
Your BoM is larger than mine anyway :)

three4thsforsaken October 6 2008 11:26 PM EDT

I already have EBs, but I'm willing to try BGs sometime. Right now isn't the best time, as I have no BA. I'll probably rent them out sometime.

But I doubt the BGs will make a difference on the targets I need. Even with a 30% boost in damage, that's not going to make the difference in killing an extra minion in a round in most cases.

Little Anthony October 6 2008 11:30 PM EDT

why you train AS? Omg pure HP works better.
Why you want to train CoC? it is weak.
If you want to kill in range, go all range. That's the power of single minion strategy. Stick with either range or melee. not half :P

and you have too low of HP anyway.

Sickone October 6 2008 11:35 PM EDT

Well, AoF+AS is half-decent... but still...

SuperHD October 6 2008 11:47 PM EDT

upgrade range output spend USD its worth it especially at your level...go for it, range kill are crucial...fun is everything

Sickone October 6 2008 11:58 PM EDT

First, he's not planning to spend any USD (or at least so I hope).
Second, he's not an archer, he's a Halidon Familiar user, so he can't use CB$ to upgrade ranged damage (there's no weapon to pump the x to).

three4thsforsaken October 7 2008 12:05 AM EDT

The AS was more to keep Hal alive, and keep FB spread fire. Which was a large issue during my growth

Wizard'sFirstRule October 7 2008 12:35 AM EDT

I suppose a DM backed by some spreadfire would take out the killslots.

Sickone October 15 2008 9:28 AM EDT

So... it looks like (might be a bit off) you went with full junction, +11 AoF, +10 Corn and +13 NSC (plus DB) on top of the 7.5 mil tattoo which is now an IF and 15+ mil AS ?

That gives you, what, aprox 12 mil HP on leading minion, 16 mil HP on the familiar, with nearly 10 mil effective CoC levels ?
Looks pretty damned impressive, actually :)

AdminNemesia [Demonic Serenity] October 15 2008 11:08 AM EDT

I tried out SF before IF and while it would have added Soul Collector it was less of a stable build. Overall IF is better.

Little Anthony October 15 2008 11:12 AM EDT

I feel like i am playin' against two people. This is so hard to win :(

AdminNemesia [Demonic Serenity] October 15 2008 11:15 AM EDT

You dont have to worry, I am more or less stepping out for the next year. I have about 1 hour left.

Little Anthony October 15 2008 11:21 AM EDT

next year??...that's like few months away. Looks like i 'd have to look for a partner on CB soon. Of course when money is no subject to me.

AdminNemesia [Demonic Serenity] October 15 2008 11:23 AM EDT

I wish it were a few months. But its about a year from now so next october.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] October 15 2008 11:25 AM EDT

you two are awesome!

three4thsforsaken October 15 2008 12:14 PM EDT

I love ya too Nem... I'm going to miss you.



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