My strategy and the accumulation of -CP's (in General)


Goodfish December 12 2008 4:14 PM EST

So I'm running a rather unused strategy right now, mostly because it's terrible. I don't mind this, as I have found a number of strategies that I simply destroy (not many, mind you). However, my problem is that since so many other strategies can defeat me, I tend to accrue massive negative clan points. This wouldn't be a problem if I could only keep my clan points above 3k net (since I'm farmed between -2300 and -2700).

Basically, I'm wondering if there is anything I can do to offset this ridiculous farming. I'm not really complaining, I just don't want to be unfair to my clanmates. Retrain my score down? Get rid of a skill/spell and train something else? Move my minions around? MOAR NETWURTH?

QBJohnnywas December 12 2008 4:29 PM EST

Strat looks fine (might go EF instead of IF if it was me but...),

But there a few things that raise an eyebrow:

have you tried an AoF instead of the AoI on the junction minion? While you're protecting against mageseekers you're missing out on extra damage from your familiar.

Your tank seems pretty small: is it a recent addition? Easy to say but I'd be trying to make it bigger.

And the exbow. While it might help reduce tank damage so would doing decent damage in ranged; which would also help against mage teams too. Does an elb or mageseeker make a difference? I'd try it out. It's one of the things rentals are for after all.

And negative clan points? Not much is going to help that. Sometimes you end up caught in that place with a clan. And the only way out of it is to leave the clan. And then wait until you're off the farmers' fightlists and then rejoin...

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] December 12 2008 4:32 PM EST

minimize your losses by fighting only clanners & do not draw, sm or lose against anyone, if you have any that you get these results on regularly in your list remove them. if you cannot afford to buy ba, then make sure you miss none of your natural regen each day.

QBJohnnywas December 12 2008 4:34 PM EST

Looking through your recent battles, some of the people hitting you for the most points are bigger teams than you. No strat changes are going to stop them.

It's not nice to see when it comes to clan points and bonuses but it isn't the fault of your strat. That's the main thing to remember.

three4thsforsaken December 12 2008 4:36 PM EST



You have alot of small damage dealers and little HP to back them up, I'm guessing you are very successful in melee, but have trouble surviving there.

First of all, I like where your tank is, he seems well equipped. So lets get rid of your IF. IF has too many issues at low levels and is incredibly fragile without MASSIVE amounts of HP.

Now there is many things you can do. You could change it to an HF. This will give you easy cheesy time farming most low HP ranged teams, namely FB users. Almost too easy. Chances are your tank won't even swing, which is kinda depressing IMO, so lets look at other options.

retraining the junction minion to AS and PL and going RoS might go nicely. It's not horribly efficient but you'll definitely get to swing your MoD more often. If you do, move your tank to the front, and let the PL take the hits and eventually put the other AS enchanter in the front with an AoI for SG.

Another option is going RoBF on the back minion. There are many way to retrain then, which are all kinda fun. The front AS minion should train a little PL then and then put the RoBF minion in the front or back to mess with farmers. Give it good HP or train AS, or be creative :)

If you insist on keeping the last minion a DD familiar, just try them all, I think you'll find yourself in a good place with an EF. But make sure you retrain that SG into something defensive, like AMF or AS.

Marlfox [Cult of the Valaraukar] December 12 2008 4:36 PM EST

Going with Dude's suggestions, I'd remove JS and Slayer from your fightlist.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] December 12 2008 4:54 PM EST

between 3 opponents whom you do not win 100 percent of the time you actually lost or drew 94 battles. if you turn all of those into wins against bonus clan members, then it would give you almost 600 more cp's for the last 24 hours.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] December 12 2008 4:58 PM EST

it would actually help you quite a bit more than that, as almost 60 of those are losses, so they are now costing you negative 250 points or so and you would be converting that to positive 600 for a net gain of over 800 clan points.

Kefeck [BlackSmith] December 12 2008 5:01 PM EST

Not to mention the exp. side of it. 60 BA is equal to about 2k mpr or so, maybe a bit more.

Rawr December 12 2008 8:17 PM EST

Your IF does the most damage on your team when I fight you, but it dies in 2 rounds versus my GA and AMf. Perhaps more damage to outdo the GA (which will be difficult) or just stack HP's with an ablative shield. Not many run around with DM and GA.

Rawr December 12 2008 8:18 PM EST

oh you do have an as.. well then I dunno :(

Eliteofdelete [Battle Royale] December 12 2008 8:37 PM EST

Using an EF would help against Amf and GA also amour would be less of a problem.

Goodfish December 12 2008 9:05 PM EST

"Strat looks fine (might go EF instead of IF if it was me but...)"
I've certainly thought about it, but right now I'm not willing to pay 800k to switch familiars. I love the IF for mashing teams with 3+minions, and its concentrated damage is very good too.

"have you tried an AoF instead of the AoI on the junction minion? While you're protecting against mageseekers you're missing out on extra damage from your familiar."
I do not have the money for an AoF. I will rent one and see how it pans out.

"Your tank seems pretty small: is it a recent addition? Easy to say but I'd be trying to make it bigger."
I started single mage with CoC/IF, and at 400k MPR I hired my tank. I just hired my 3rd minion (AS enchanter) at 1M MPR. I could try a RoE on the tank for a while but I think it would weaken me so much that I would no longer win against anyone in my fightlist. I intend on pouring cash into my MoD as soon as I'm out of debt and finish my gear setup for my tank, so about 5mil CBD from now.

"And the exbow. While it might help reduce tank damage so would doing decent damage in ranged; which would also help against mage teams too. Does an elb or mageseeker make a difference? I'd try it out. It's one of the things rentals are for after all."
I use it mostly so I can survive against archers a bit longer. Granted, my exbow is REALLY tiny, but once I get it up to about x800, it should get much more effective. I don't really want to get the ranged penalty of a bow without Archery, but I may very well check out rentals. Part of the problem with my tank is simply the NW most other characters have on me. I spent a ton of money on my equipment as it is, and I have no clue how people at my MPR have 3 times my NW.

"retraining the junction minion to AS and PL and going RoS might go nicely. It's not horribly efficient but you'll definitely get to swing your MoD more often. If you do, move your tank to the front, and let the PL take the hits and eventually put the other AS enchanter in the front with an AoI for SG."
three4ths, I love most of your suggestions (as they certainly make me think about where I want to go with my strategy), but I hatehatehate the RoS. I whine about it pretty frequently in chat and forums, and I won't be hypocritical and use one. ;) However, switching to a different familiar may certainly be my best option at this point. Considering most of my damage is dealt by my IF, though, I am reluctant to switch to EF/Hal simply because of the "overkill" damage I would deal. Spread damage is much more "controlled" and damage isn't "wasted" (a Hal that does 2mil damage against a target with 900k hp does a lot of "overkill" damage).

"between 3 opponents whom you do not win 100 percent of the time you actually lost or drew 94 battles. if you turn all of those into wins against bonus clan members, then it would give you almost 600 more cp's for the last 24 hours."
To be honest, I feel like a moron after reading this. Half the time I'm draining my BA, I don't even look at the fights, I just mash ENTER until my BA is gone. Naturally, this should help, although it's a shame losing people that I actually have a decent CB against (most of my CB's are less than 40%).

"Your IF does the most damage on your team when I fight you, but it dies in 2 rounds versus my GA and AMf. Perhaps more damage to outdo the GA (which will be difficult) or just stack HP's with an ablative shield. Not many run around with DM and GA."
This is kind of the problem with my strategy. Well over 75% of my damage comes from an uncontrollable source (my IF). This is why I hired the third minion (AS)- to keep my IF alive just a bit longer. Like was suggested earlier, I may add an AoF to my strategy, which would both boost the AS my mage receives, and boost my familiar's DD by a hearty amount. It definitely sucks that my AS is so small comparatively.

Thank you all for your help... I might revive this thread in a few days if my CP's don't start turning around. ;)

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] December 12 2008 9:12 PM EST

don't feel moronic, when at these levels with all the n*b's around things change quickly. what i do that seems to work pretty well is just check the 24 battle logs at least once a day and make sure that i am winning above 90 percentile on all attacks, 100 percent if my fight list is over ten.

Rawr December 12 2008 9:13 PM EST

Have you considered AMF over DM?

Rawr December 12 2008 9:14 PM EST

If you're rolling with a MoD, the double damage on AS will be awesome, so DM won't be needed i think.

Goodfish December 12 2008 9:16 PM EST

Rawr: Yes, I actually had AMF for a long time before switching to DM. The thing that sucks about AMF is that, without a massive AMF (which my exp distribution simply doesn't allow), I'm casting it for 0.4 or lower on most minions, lower against familiars, and even lower against NSC minions/junctioned familiars. It felt like "wasted" experience (except against FB users, which as we all know dwindle rapidly above 1M MPR). I switched to DM to help combat my hatred of AS, and it also helps a bit versus GA. Granted, lots of GA/AS users have a Rune of Solitude to back them up, but against those who don't, the DM is very, very handy.

dudemus: I'll have to start analyzing my progress a bit more carefully. This NCB has been way too haphazardly played and I'm already working on setting up my next one. =\

Rawr December 12 2008 9:20 PM EST

i love coc spread damage, i miss it :P

Goodfish December 12 2008 10:23 PM EST

Hence my love for my IF. :)
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