Bug in tutorial which should be fixed first. (in General)


AdminShade August 15 2009 10:58 AM EDT

I've tried a few times but it keeps on doing the same. While that is good in terms of reliability, what it does makes it worrying.



First you have to fight some, to get exp and money.
Then you will train.
Then you fight some more.
Then you enlist a second minion, and fight yet again.

Then it tells you to TRAIN a spell on your second minion.

Then at the training screen, it stupidly tells you to fight again!



Then when having the amount of fights done, you click train.





And it just lets you enlist yet another stupid minion, after which you get to fight again!!!

This seriously is wrong and this particular thing needs to be fixed asap because it even confuses veterans...

Solare August 15 2009 11:44 AM EDT

Yes, this has been a problem for quite some time.
It certainly does need attention. Thanks for looking into it!

AdminShade August 15 2009 12:07 PM EDT

The problem lies in the fact that there now is a serious loophole...



The fix I would suggest would be fighting as many fights it takes to generate the amount of experience it would cost to train the Magic Missile spell on the new (second) minion.

Magic Missile costs 12 experience to be trained (at base level).
To have 12 Experience on a new minion, using the cheapest option of enlisting would make you spend (12 * 5 = ) only $60 if I am correct.
Considering the low amount of money involved this could easily be reached.



This would make the tutorial look like this:

- With character you've been given, check equipment. Wow a whip, how sadistic.
- Fight an _X_ amount of fights to generate money and experience.
- Click train, in which you are asked to train DX.
- Fight another _Y_ amount of fights to generate some more money and experience.
- Click train, in which you train some HP (1/3 max), ST (1/2 max) and DX (Max). Values in ( ) are examples but these already teach enough about training system.

Then!!!

- Click Enlist new minion, followed by immediately training Magic Missile because this new minion should have 12 Experience already!
- Then you can opt for fighting some _Z_ amount of fights.
- Then you opt either to train or not, after which you visit the store to buy any melee weapon the user will pick.
- When the weapon is bought, let the player click equip and equip the item.
- End of tutorial, welcome to understandable Carnage Blender and Chat Blender.

Admiralkiller August 15 2009 12:27 PM EDT

A few things should be changed in the tutorial.

I know many have said this before me and many after will say it again.

A few suggestions.

1. Fix the bugs as stated above.
2. Other sites let you collect awards/achievements (these can be immediately addictive and fun to collect all of them.
3. Not such a ridged tutorial. (If a new person gets turned off from a tutorial they will immediately leave and never come back.) I hated being forced to make a character I did not like, among other things I was forced to do when I felt it was useless.
4. I am sure there are many more but It has been about 5 months since I was doing it.
5. A forced suggestion box at the end of the tutorial at the end to help continuing improvements in the future.

Not trying to be rude just trying to help with my 2 cents.:-)

AdminShade August 15 2009 12:38 PM EDT

AK, some of your suggestions are either not that simple for a game like this, or just not possible:

2. Other sites let you collect awards/achievements (these can be immediately addictive and fun to collect all of them.

While nice of you to note, we already have achievements for new players. These could be modified to make more addictive to collect but are not directly linked to any tutorial. I know no other site which has achievements inside of a tutorial.



3. Not such a ridged tutorial. (If a new person gets turned off from a tutorial they will immediately leave and never come back.) I hated being forced to make a character I did not like, among other things I was forced to do when I felt it was useless.

You felt it useless because you knew the game, a completely new player does not have this feeling. This makes this point not really a point to focus on initially.



4. I am sure there are many more but it has been about 5 months since I was doing it.

What do you mean exactly? Many more of what?



5. A forced suggestion box at the end of the tutorial at the end to help continuing improvements in the future.

In which way do you mean? For the new player to make a suggestion about the game itself?

Admiralkiller August 15 2009 1:12 PM EDT

Okay since I did not explained myself well I will try harder.

2. Achievements/awards/badges (name it what you want) that you get for certain parts of the tutorial and past. e.g.
10k mpr 10k NW (more ideas here)
100k mpr 100k NW
1 million mpr 1 million NW
2 million mpr 50 million NW
5 million mpr 100 million NW etc. etc.

The lower end ones could be included as part of the tutorial. The higher end ones could be a helpful guide for players well after the tutorial.
I have no clue how hard this would be so if it's hard work Never mind.

3. Some players who player rpg/strat games usually enjoy making a certain type of character. I have always like fighters and hated mages. I disliked being forced to make a mage. Spending my XP when I was trying to save it for something else. Hiring minions when I didn't want to.

4. I am sure there are more suggestions that me and others could suggest.

5. A forced suggestion box that asks how they thought the tutorial was and how they have enjoyed the game so far. (Fresh ideas and input from people who have never played before could help improve the Average of ...new players starting/new players staying).

In general my point is that the tutorial needs improvement beyond the bugs. I know I was not new to CB but I was new to The CB as it is now, I did not enjoy doing the tutorial.

AdminShade August 15 2009 1:14 PM EDT

2: The tutorial which we have doesn't make you get past 10k mpr so these things would be achievements past the tutorial. Otherwise it would take far too long since the tutorial would not make you able to get into chat before it would pass.

3: If you would have never played CB, would you know about wasting experience? I'd think not.

Admiralkiller August 15 2009 1:23 PM EDT

2. Your getting into specifics now shade. 2k 5k 10k....it's the suggestion not the exact #'s.

3. Yes your right at the beginning you don't realize your wasting BA but you soon realize that NUB is a 1 time thing that should not be wasted. I still wish I could get all my BA back from the tutorial.

AdminShade August 15 2009 1:26 PM EDT

All your BA back from tutorial? Past few tutorials I only spent a maximum of 40, say 50 BA.

Consider my change would bring the maximum even further down because it stops you from doing some things double or triple this can hardly have any effect on your total BA spent.

Admiralkiller August 15 2009 1:29 PM EDT

Well if that number is correct my wasting BA point is wrong. It felt like a lot more to make the character I was forced to then retrain and fix.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] August 15 2009 1:31 PM EDT

i didn't want to clutter up this thread with non-tutorial ideas, but ak made me think of an idea. it is in my achievements thread.

AdminShade August 15 2009 1:33 PM EDT

AK: considering the loop the tutorial is bringing players in, this number could have been a bit higher. Considering the change I'm proposing, it should never be higher than that. :)

Admiralkiller August 15 2009 1:38 PM EDT

Sorry shade I am not disagreeing with what you proposed I am just adding more suggestions.

AdminShade August 15 2009 1:43 PM EDT

I know and your suggestions were good ones to think about. :)

Sickone August 15 2009 2:00 PM EDT

Just completely separate the tutorial from the actual game.

First off, make it skippable at any time. Seriously. It's a long time ago, but I remember it being quite confusing.
Second, tell the player at the start his tutorial character progress will be reset at the end of the tutorial... and do so (but give him back the BA used up on the tutorial, and reset the NUB finish time so that the END of the tutorial concides with the start of the NUB).
In other words, make it so that for all intents and purposes, when you start the tutorial is the first time you start spending "real" BA.
And finally, allow EVERYBODY to run the tutorial again at any time later.

Come to think of it, why not have it so that there's a separate realm, "TUTORIAL", where everybody gets 300 starter BA and is treated pretty much the same as a tournament character ?

AdminShade August 16 2009 7:09 AM EDT

That would involve a reasonable large amount of recoding. It would be nice perhaps but initially I'd like to see this problem fixed first...

Flamey August 16 2009 8:34 AM EDT

I agree with the sandbox idea. It allows people to try out some things during the tutorial. I hate to say it but runescape has a brilliant tutorial made for itself. It's not sandbox, but it lets you run around the island until you're comfortable. Of course when there's no BA, there's no need for a sandbox. So with BA, we need a sandbox.
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