Exbow/Axbow are better now ?? (in General)

I don't have exbow/axbow so I can't test them out. However, my light Tank started out with like 20K str and got hit twice by Axbow. The result is -17K str.

I was under assumption that Axbow/Exbow only takes off a % of my Str/Dex based on the +. It seems the latest change created a min cap on top of the %. That is why my str went to -17K. If it only takes a % off, there is no way my str went to - without EC.

Can anyone test this theory out and confirm this behavior? It seems axbow/exbow is acting more like EC now.

I thought the old formula was based on the X. Anyway, it's now adjusted (see changelog) so you have a base amount, and additional points per X (not %). So I'm knocking the strength out of targets pretty quick. And if the hit pushes them below 0 strength it doesn't list the "looks weaker" in the fightlog.

WOW, now indeed Axbow/Exbow are much better since they have a minimum cap plus a %, versus only a % before.

And that means my new strat 'The Trinity' pwns :D

Will, grow your Trinity a bit more so I can start farming him. I am getting bored of farming your F.E.A.R

8^)

In time young sparrow :p

Even in a month you'd still be able to farm me with that HUGE Dispell

"I don't have exbow/axbow so I can't test them out. However, my light Tank started out with like 20K str and got hit twice by Axbow. The result is -17K str."

pretty impressive being hit by an assassin's crossbow (that lowers DX) and having negative ST...





"I was under assumption that Axbow/Exbow only takes off a % of my Str/Dex based on the +. It seems the latest change created a min cap on top of the %. That is why my str went to -17K. If it only takes a % off, there is no way my str went to - without EC."

they also used to go with X instead of +, most likely they now have a base drain also





Can anyone test this theory out and confirm this behavior? It seems axbow/exbow is acting more like EC now.

I have a nice character without EC and with an Exbow at X40. perhaps you can figure some things out from the fights you do against me ;)

from what Jon said in his post, A/Exbow still drain based on X (and the added base drain)

unless you have an A/Exbow that drains over 100% DX/ST, you will never get negative ST by being hit by one.

(at least, thats how im pretty sure it works? :P)

well i just did some tests and i easily drained more than 100% of someones ST with my exbow.

i will put up a nice post with my findings tomorrow :)

I think it may be a bug.

wow, if it aint a bug, i know what im buying next ; )

Shade, you hit me 3 times with your exbow. My str was 21K. End up:

Old Dwarf's bulldog 33 90,483 -38,059 1,968 177 6,188 / 2,567 847

-38K! str for 3 +40 hit.. so at worst case +40% + 10% base = 50% * 3 = 150% (just to make general) = can't figure out the math... hahaha

MAN, this is wacky.

and Shade, fight with your char more often so I can start farming you!

*weakling* 8^)

Arorr: there is a non percentage drain now so 40%+10% doesn't make sense.

Made a nice table from some fighting results but i can't seem to figure out how to process them :S

further calculating the hits from The Trinity against me: (just got update that the xbows were X25

ST before fight = 171214
after getting hit 1ce = 151628 | 19586 reducing
after getting hit 2ce = 133609 | 37605 reducing (in 2 hits together)

calculating the % reduction from 1 hit: 19586 / 151628 * 100% this would come to a:

11,4394851% ST drain from first hit

for the second hit which drained 37605-19586 = 18019 ST this would then become:

11,883689% ST drain from second hit


but from this thead

"Increased drain by axbow/exbow; also added a non-percentage factor to make them more useful at low levels."


or so to say im puzzled...

In order to test the "non-percentage factor" on these, ya need to find someone with a base ax/exbow. Then, you can figure out the EC side of it, determine if that grows with the x as well as the percentage drain, and try to figure out what the new percentage per x is.

indeed i would need a pretty much base Exbow Axbow for it.

problem would be finding it.

Yesterday i also tested some things with the difference between my X40 (which is named) and Wills X20 exbow:

ST before fight: 170449
ST after getting hit 1 time X20: 153292 | 17157 reduction
ST after getting hit 2 times X20: 137250 | 33199 reduction

ST after getting hit 2 times X40: 112169 | 58280 reduction

% ST reduction for 1st hit (X20 exbow): 10.0657675%
% ST reduction for 2nd hit (X20 exbow): 10.4649949%

% ST reduction for 2 hits from named X40 exbow: 34.1920457%

making an equation from this gives:

100-34.192% = 65.808%

solving 65.808 = 100 * X * X gives X being 0.811 making it a 100 - 81.1 = 18.9% ST drain for the X40 named Exbow per hit. but again this is without taking into account a non percentual drain ...

For the base, petition for one to be voted into the Blackmarket auctions, then whoever gets it can give you data.

in addition: (sorry for all the posts)

ST after getting hit 2 times X20: 137250 | 33199 reduction

ST after getting hit 2 times X40: 112169 | 58280 reduction

X40 drains 58280 / 33199 = 175.547% of the drain of the X20
(which isnt double so the % based is lower than 0.5% per X)

then for calculation there is the additional problem that we don't know how the non percentage drain is put in (i think its a base number per X)

= = = = = = = = = =

some brain thinkings:

ST before fight: 170449
ST after getting hit 1 time with X20: 153292 | 17157 reduction
ST after getting hit 2 times with X20: 137250 | 33199 reduction

ST drain from second hit with X20 (33199-17157) | 16042 reduction

if it would be .33% per X and a base amount then:

for X20 it would drain 6.667% ST per hit + a base amount.

13.333% of 170449 ST = 11363.26 points of ST drained from percentage factor.

then it would be 17157-11363.26 = 5794 drain from non percentage factor which would result in 5794 / 20 = 289.7 drain per X

= = = = = = = = = =

filling those things in for the X40 Exbow

40 times 0.33% = 13.333% ST drain per hit
would then become 170449 * 13.333% = 22726.5 points drain

plus the 40 times 290 = 11600 raw points drain per hit

22726 + 11600 = 34326 points drain for first hit.

the ST would then be 170449 - 34326 = 136123

second hit then would drain:

136123 * 13.333% = 18150 as % drain
plus 11600 = 29750 points of drain from second hit.

this would make me have 136123 - 29750 = 106373 ST after getting hit twice.
making the total drain being 64076 points

looking back:

ST after getting hit 2 times X40: 112169 | 58280 reduction

makes this calculation being over the results received from the post battle stats.

= = = = = = = = = =

what if it would be 0.33% per X and 250

then X20 exbow would drain 6.667% + 5000 points each hit

having ST 170449 and getting hit 1 time this would be:

6.667% of 170449 = 11363 points
+5000 = 16363 points drain (which is little lower than the 17157 drain from post battle stats)

my brain hurts right now but im sure it has something to do with ~0.33% drain per X and a base number of around the 250 points per X also.

only more testing can reveal the truth here (because jonathan can't be bribed to tell :P)

indeed cooper for the base it could be handy to vote for it in black market.

but im also more worried by the damage the thing would be doing (use higher X ammo and not have any AC on the fighting char could help that though)

the base exbow axbow would need to do some damage :)

Best case scenario would be base ammo on the base exbow or base axbow. Two people would start a new character and get their stats exactly the same, basically training strength, dex and hp at equal levels. Get both of the characters up to about 500 or 1,000 PR level (MPR). Then one of the character would use the said xbow on the other. I think this would be the best way to test these xbows.

ammunition upgrades don't matter for the drain, it also doesnt matter howmuch damage you do, only thing that matters is that you DO at least 1 point of damage, thats all.

but about making it easy... 2 people could make just a simple tank with x ST and DX and quite some HP to test it, i would be willing to convert a farm of mine for this.

If you know that the drain from one hit is of the form
(A + B *STR) * N,
where A and B are constants, N is the axbow X, and STR is the strength before the drain,
you do not need a base axbow to compute A and B, only many examples with different STR.
If there is no randomness involved, two fights with people with different STR are enough to determine A and B.

Of course, if the formula above is not the right one, you need more data: but after a few fights with different people and different axbows, you should be able to see if the data fit the formula or not.

the formula is x% +yx


in which x is the X of the weapon
and +y is a number that also increases with the X of the weapon.

also there are no randomnesses.

I fought 2 different characters with different ST but with the same X25 exbow and both drained the same amounts of ST from me.

or the 'yx' could be just tied to strength, or nw, or the +...

and randomness isn't involved, shade and I tested that. (My char has equal ST on all chars and the draining was the same).

Yep, Exbow/Axbow is going to be the favorite of the month very soon, after Shade is done with his finding.

I was hoping that it would tie to Dex/Str. Without this link, an E with big exbow/axbow can hurt light T to - dex/str. Just doesn't fit well with me.

an enchanter with a fairly base Exbow or Axbow won't do damage and thus won't drain stats.

You only need to train a little str (less than 1K) on you enchanter to do damage, and therefore drain stat.

wrong: that enchanter will be looking up against 100K ST and 200 AC tanks possibly with ToE so damage will be reduced to 0 :)


i have already seen many characters with 50000 ST and a X20 exbow doing no damage to me... so no drain