Free untraining (in Changelog)

AdminJonathan September 19 2006 12:21 AM EDT

Swagger was the first to notice. :)

I'll leave this up at least until Saturday morning. May be extended if we're having fun, but no longer than the end of changemonth, obviously.

So feel safe to goof around but I'd leave my minions in a sane configuration Friday night if I were you. Just in case. :)

Update:: extended to Sunday morning.

QBRanger September 19 2006 12:22 AM EDT


Most awesome change ever!!!!

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 19 2006 12:22 AM EDT

oh sweet mother macree, chaos reigns!

QBsutekh137 September 19 2006 12:24 AM EDT

This sandbox is going to rock harder than Thunderdome!

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 19 2006 12:24 AM EDT

Wow, so this is going to allow some folks who've been saddled with large chars to repair huge damage...I'm in awe of this...

Rubberduck[T] [Hell Blenders] September 19 2006 12:41 AM EDT

Yea, this is a big one. Too bad I like my ratios as they are;)

QBOddBird September 19 2006 12:42 AM EDT

Unarmed Combat: 5,349,461/3,880,910 (212)

Now to simply hit it myself!

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 19 2006 12:43 AM EDT

Well that's frightening...I do see a drop in rangers MPR...might this retraining not be quite so free, or is his xp distribution causing the drop?

Tezmac September 19 2006 12:44 AM EDT

Yeah, mine has been dropping too, not sure if Jon has a way to track this or not.

QBRanger September 19 2006 12:45 AM EDT

My MPR is dropping since i have a bunch of untrained xp on my character. I trained it all and my MPR is the same as before.

QBRanger September 19 2006 12:47 AM EDT

Remember MPR is only TRAINED xp.

AdminShade September 19 2006 5:39 AM EDT

hmmm, why didn't I wait for the untraining until today? >.<

QBJohnnywas September 19 2006 5:52 AM EDT

oh nice change for those amongst the ranks who like to tinker...

Brakke Bres [Ow man] September 19 2006 7:25 AM EDT

Told ya shade, wait until the change month is over :P

AdminShade September 19 2006 8:09 AM EDT

It's only a small amount though, 5% of 1.2 mil (still a rough 60k exp, or 4750 HP, small)

However it is very handy for other retrainings...

BootyGod September 19 2006 8:46 AM EDT

/me kisses Jon's feet and runs away

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] September 19 2006 8:51 AM EDT

How about making every quarterly change month a 'free untraining' month?

QBsutekh137 September 19 2006 10:44 AM EDT

Let's use this thread for education things, OK? I am going to do two things: show all attributes effect when at 3.3 million (most of those are known ratios, but it will still be fun), and also finding more precisely the 12, 13, 14, 15, and 16 experience-per-level switchovers. That data is piecemeal throughout the CB-verse, but this seems a good place to put it...

Mikel September 19 2006 11:14 AM EDT

This is fun :)

BootyGod September 19 2006 11:27 AM EDT

I am with Sut on this.

My data. At over 10 mil exp You get a 31 Protection. Not bad ;)

But stacking the 7 mil from my other character (17 mil xp) I only went to 32.

ALl I got for right now.

QBsutekh137 September 19 2006 12:08 PM EDT

Here is all the level/effect information I could come up with by untraining everything and then putting it all into each stat. Hopefully the table is self-explanatory. I was going to add this to the Wiki, but I have no idea where to put it. Feel free to copy it there and feel free to take credit for it. *smile*

Minion: Joe (EXP: 81,461,027)
Level: 5,414,553
Intrinsics Effect Effect/Level
HP 5,414,553 1
STR 5,414,553 1
DEX 5,414,553 1
Archery N/A (easily hits 1.00) N/A
Bloodlust N/A (easily hits 0.60) N/A
Evasion 230 N/A
Phantom Link 9,746,195 1.80
Unarmed Combat 213 N/A
Direct Damage
Fireball 687,151 0.13
Cone of Cold 1,030,726 0.19
Decay N/A (1) N/A
Magic Missile 2,576,817 0.48
Ethereal Chains 2,707,296 0.50
Anti-magic Field N/A N/A
Dispel Magic 4,331,642 0.80
Ablative Shield (1 minion) 2,707,286 0.50
Giant Strength 3,693,285 0.68
Haste 3,693,285 0.68
Vampiric Aura N/A N/A
Guardian Angel N/A N/A
Protection 33 N/A

QBsutekh137 September 19 2006 1:35 PM EDT

OK, as far as experience cost per level switch points, I think this work has already been done... But here goes anyway:

Experience Cost Per Level Still Within Switched
8 2,999 3,000
9 8,122 8,123
10 22,045 22,046
11 59,893 59,894
12 162,750 162,798
13 442,000 442,495
14 1,200,000 1,204,841
15 3,265,618 3,270,000

Basically this just reiterates the exponential nature of the switches using the equation:

L = e^C

where L is the level at which cost C becomes C + 1. "e" is the base of the natural logarithm (also known as Euler's Number) = 2.71828183.

The equation is a tad off, I assume because of the base learning costs.

So, this means that the switch from 16 to 17 would be at:

L = e^16 = 8,886,110

Going for level 10 million of anything is, shall we say, difficult. *smile*

Miandrital September 19 2006 10:46 PM EDT

Wow sute, thats awesome!

AdminNightStrike September 20 2006 2:37 AM EDT

To clarify those training levels, since I keep reverting the wiki page, as an example the cost to go from 2999 to 3000 is 8 xp, while the cost to go from 3000 to 3001 is 9 xp.

Also, your fireball numbers make me happy that I projected the training rate of fireball correctly. I'll update the wiki for cone of cold :)

QBsutekh137 September 20 2006 7:09 AM EDT

Excellent, NS!

AdminNightStrike September 20 2006 8:32 AM EDT

162,774 / 162,775 = 12/13

Maelstrom September 20 2006 2:29 PM EDT

Hehe, now if only we could get free re-inking of tattoos, for a short time. Then we could really try out some different strategies ;)

AdminShade September 20 2006 2:44 PM EDT

"where L is the level at which cost C becomes C + 1. "e" is the base of the natural logarithm (also known as Euler's Number) = 2.71828183.

The equation is a tad off, I assume because of the base learning costs. "

can't you add them to the equation?

Miandrital September 20 2006 6:31 PM EDT

"The equation is a tad off, I assume because of the base learning costs.

can't you add them to the equation? "

Yes in fact you can:

ceiling(e^x + 19) (ti-89 syntax)

This gives the switch values as:
1: 22
2: 27
3: 40
4: 74
5: 168
6: 423
7: 1,116
8: 3,000
9: 8,123
10: 2,2046
11: 59,894
12: 162,774
13: 442,433
14: 1,202,624
15: 3,269,037
16: 8,886,130
17: 24,154,972
18: 65,659,989

If/when sutekh hits a 9 mil fb we can probably safely say he has hit the max training cost for a single spell.

btw I will post this in the wiki.

Mikel September 20 2006 11:42 PM EDT

You know what?
This is the first change that no one has complained about, since I've been playing anyways.

WeaponX September 21 2006 10:17 AM EDT

i have a request. since we get free untraining can you give is a week of free re inking?

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] September 21 2006 1:48 PM EDT

it was by accident, i dont think well see free inking.

tscm September 21 2006 8:51 PM EDT

I lubber this soooo much. This should be a NEW CB TRADITION. It's just as good if not better than carping!!!! :) :)

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] September 21 2006 10:10 PM EDT

what is going to be funny is the lack of people retraining from here on out, in hopes that someday Jon will once again see fit to allow this kind of revelry

Genie September 22 2006 9:43 PM EDT

I love this change, and i hope it doesn't happen to often (if at all anymore) once a year at the most because if it was done more often people would wait until they could have free retraining and never lose any mpr. imaging how big a NUB % will be? o.0

AdminJonathan September 22 2006 11:39 PM EDT

see update to original post

velvetpickle September 23 2006 3:33 PM EDT

Any chance we can get another MPB reset when the experimental period is over Jon? :)

bartjan September 23 2006 3:39 PM EDT

I doubt that's going to happen. This time it's you yourself who's to blame for inflating your MPB ;)

Angel of Death [Hell Blenders] September 24 2006 8:23 AM EDT

so i guess its over now

AdminShade September 24 2006 8:23 AM EDT

still 100% unlearning here ;)

AdminJonathan September 24 2006 9:28 AM EDT

it's over.

untrain gains are now 90% for "intrinsics" and 95% for everything else.

Flamey September 24 2006 9:30 AM EDT

cool, cheaper un-training, still for the better!

velvetpickle September 24 2006 1:44 PM EDT

c'mon bart, you know we couldn't resist seeing what a few million exp trained to str would do :)

AdminShade September 24 2006 1:46 PM EDT

It isn't even so much the ST for causing that huge MPB...

SNK used 5 million ST, which is 4 times as big as the current biggest ST.

That alone only doubles the damage dealt, so the MPB could have been half of that huge number, but still being big.
This thread is closed to new posts. However, you are welcome to reference it from a new thread; link this with the html <a href="/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001uDT">Free untraining</a>