Remember when.... (in General)


QBRanger August 15 2007 4:17 PM EDT

The ELB, corn and DBs were the most expensive items to buy?

Now its the MgS, and HoC. My how things changed.

Godpanda August 15 2007 4:19 PM EDT

Hmmm... I do remember. More money, more players... changes. To be expected.

Wasp [Demon Forging] August 15 2007 4:40 PM EDT

HoC is almost a neccessity, and being a supporter item, in short demand. MgS is always great to have for walls, and being a supporter item, are hard to come by. Add this with increasing new players and minions, and you find prices getting almost silly. Glad I bought the HoC when it cost $6 from Jon : )

ignignokt August 15 2007 4:52 PM EDT

Why do you think that is the way that it is? Are mages more powerful now than archers? I think NCS might have something to do with it. I wish there was an item similar to NCS that worked against GA, seems unbalanced that people can diminish AMF but not GA.

As far as ELBs go, I think that at higher levels with everyone having 4 minions it doesn't really seem that good to have a bow that can hit for a ton of damage when you have to rip through 3 or 4 minions in order to hit a mage that's pwning you. I wish I was around to see how the mageseeker arrows worked. Although they seem to be overpowered from what I heard at least it was an option. Getting rid of mageseeker arrows and putting the mageseeker bow into place (which is 33% less damage than a similar NW ELB, not counting any difference in PTH) was a needed change to balance things out. However... the creation of the mageseeker bow left people unable to really switch over unless they spent tons of money blacksmithing a mageseeker or tons of time getting one forged.

To me, it seems like getting rid of mageseeker arrows was equilivant to nerfing something as fundamental as fireball and offering a less powerful alternative but not letting people retrain. I wonder if there's any possibility of a "retrain" for ELBs to Mageseekers, even if it were expensive (at the cost of NW instead of additional fees unless it was similar to re-ink fee). Just even if it were a one way, one time thing per character and only offered for a short time like say a week. I think it'd be more interesting and offer a lot more breadth to strategies at higher MPRs. Think about it... 2 and a half years of forging ELBs vs a few months of Mageseekers.

Just a thought :)
Ignig

toitle August 15 2007 5:07 PM EDT

there already is a completely free way to diminish GA, it's called DM

Flamey August 15 2007 5:10 PM EDT

"I think that at higher levels with everyone having 4 minions it doesn't really seem that good to have a bow that can hit for a ton of damage when you have to rip through 3 or 4 minions in order to hit a mage that's pwning you."

I'm a melee team. I have about 3 or 4 teams that kill me before Melee. Check out my Build. Over 2 mil AS in level.

Fanta [Fanta's Forge] August 15 2007 5:33 PM EDT

"Are mages more powerful now than archers? I think NCS might have something to do with it. I wish there was an item similar to NCS that worked against GA, seems unbalanced that people can diminish AMF but not GA."

Mages are definitely not better than archers... NSC specializes vs. AMF users only anyway, so some mages still prefer AGs. And GA can be negated by high AC, DM, a ToE, or high damage.

QBOddBird August 15 2007 5:50 PM EDT

"I wish I was around to see how the mageseeker arrows worked."

Thing is, only the mages saw how they worked, because the guys equipping them weren't usually fighting with them. It was just a defensive ammunition that really was entirely unfair for mages. Now it is a choice - perma-seekers at the cost of some of your (unreasonably high) damage, or stick with your unreasonably high damage?

Fanta [Fanta's Forge] August 15 2007 6:10 PM EDT

yeap... that's the way it works.

ignignokt August 15 2007 7:36 PM EDT

"Now it is a choice - perma-seekers at the cost of some of your (unreasonably high) damage, or stick with your unreasonably high damage?"

My point is that people don't have the choice. ELBs had over 2 years of forging, mageseekers have only had a few months. When other things have been changed, people have been able to retrain. That's why I was saying that a retrain for ELBs to mageseekers would be a way to give people that option. Even if it was just an irreversible, one way change that was only offered for a short time, like a week.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] August 15 2007 7:52 PM EDT

That's Easy.

Sell your ELB and take a loss ont he CB invested in it (call it a retrain cost).

Buy a MSB with the profits.

One retrain. ;)

No one willing to buy your Uber ELB of Death? Sell it to Mr Chairman.

ignignokt August 15 2007 8:15 PM EDT

That assumes that there are Mageseeker bows for sale. Look at the top list and tell me of those people who is going to sell me one that is remotely close to my WA of 45m

QBRanger August 15 2007 8:17 PM EDT

Nobody will.

This is one new item that you need to forge or blacksmith up.

48Zach August 15 2007 8:22 PM EDT

/me thinks Jon should re-introduce some of the other supporter items again..

HoC, MgS and JFK.

Lord Bob August 15 2007 8:24 PM EDT

"Glad I bought the HoC when it cost $6 from Jon "

And I was stupid enough to sell mine for a measly 1 mill when it first came out, like a big idiot.
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