RBF, AoF, HF, RoS, ToE, Archery, BNE, ELS, Evasion (in Changelog)

• Junction now transfers Focus
• HF trains archery = ST (allows increasing ST w/ GS)
• HF gets 40% more PTH and 75% more damage multiplier
• RoS: increased aura to 1/3 of lvl (was 1/4; before that, was 2/5)
• Evasion multiplier per round are now

  1.0 (was: 1.0)
  1.33 (1.66)
  1.66 (2.33)
  2.0 (3.0)
  2.33 (3.66)
  

• ToE endurance on equipping minion is now 50% of lvl (was 60%); aura is now 40% (was 35%)
• Archery: 1/3 of ST required for 1.0 (was 1/4)
• Increased BNE and ELS damage by 20%
• RBF:
  • added evasion bonus, roughly equivalent to the evasion added by a pair of DB at 1/3 the NW of the TBF. (Like DB, this evasion does not get a bonus during ranged. Also like DB, this stacks "correctly" -- 100 evasion + 100 DB is not 200 against PTH.)
  • added MM and CoC to list of damage reductions (besides FB, this already included exploding shot and other TBFs)
  • Increased damage reduction by 10%
  • Switched immolation from GA-style reaction to active damage; increased damage by 20%
  • Removed aura

WOOOOOOOOOOOT!

Wow. Active month. Thanks Jonathan.

ToE aura effect is increased??

/me still thinks the TBF needs its aura.

Rubberduck[T], 5:49 PM EDT
ToE aura effect is increased??


My thoughts exactly....huh?!?

Is the aura 40% of the equipping minions endurance or 40% ToE level?

"Increased BNE and BTh damage by 20%"

Should that not be ELS instead of Bth?

Yes, ELS.

QBRanger, 5:53 PM EDT "Increased BNE and BoTh damage by 20%"

Should that not be ELS instead of BoTh?

Seconded... At least give the ELS some chance of being used.

Ahh... I see... Took me a year and a half to post a reply because of the stupid need of the spellcheck...

Why doesn't an admin put BoTH and BNE into the dictionary/spellchecklist/whatever?

"aura is now 40% (was 35%)"

I *KNEW* aura wasn't 7%!

"Warrior Priest of Sigmar decapitated Guardian [69407544]"

"RBF:

* added evasion bonus, roughly equivalent to the evasion added by a pair of DB at 1/3 the NW of the TBF. (Like DB, this evasion does not get a bonus during ranged. Also like DB, this stacks "correctly" -- 100 evasion + 100 DB is not 200 against PTH.)
* added MM and CoC to list of damage reductions (besides FB, this already included exploding shot and other TBFs)
* Increased damage reduction by 10%
* Switched immolation from GA-style reaction to active damage; increased damage by 20%
* Removed aura "

Good to see the buffs, but why did you add evasion back in? You had it in there a while ago, and took it out. It's counter-intuitive to the purpose of a TBF -- that is, you WANT to get hit. Evasion prevents that.

Also, the Aura was what made it useful... It will be interesting to see if it has gotten any better with these changes. Unfortunately, though, my tattoo is unavailable for a while yet :(

"Switched immolation from GA-style reaction to active damage; increased damage by 20%"

Also, what does this mean? GA damage is a % of damage inflicted. TBF damage was not based on damage inflicted previously. What is "active damage"?

Lol

Are we sure evasion multipliers have been enacted?

I still miss Hubbell in all missile rounds and still miss Conundrum in the first 2 but hit in 3/4 like before this changelog.

NS, I'm assuming RBF damages regardless now which is why Evasion is back.

> GA damage is a % of damage inflicted. TBF damage was not based on damage inflicted previously.

meaning, you only took RBF damage before if you did a melee attack.

> Are we sure evasion multipliers have been enacted?

yes.

>> GA damage is a % of damage inflicted. TBF damage was not based on damage inflicted previously.

>meaning, you only took RBF damage before if you did a melee attack.

Ah, that makes more sense. I'm very curious to see how this works now... I'm guessing the TBF is not just a "Dancing Weapon" to use a D&D reference. I gotta find a tattoo to ink :)

Ok, so I found an SF over about 1.3m levels and inked it.

This is very different now. Instead of burning the person that attacked you *per hit*, you are now burning the lead minion once *per round*. The reason the TBF was worth looking at was the ability to nuke someone's ST, have them quad hit you for 200 damage, and burn them back 4 times for 200k each. Now, I really have no idea how to use it :)

Do RoBF and DBs stack together?

1.0 (was: 1.0)
1.33 (1.66)
1.66 (2.33)
2.0 (3.0)
2.33 (3.66)

Something has to be wrong.

Before this changelog I hit Conundrum in rounds 3 and 4 of missile all the time with the evasion's multiplier then of 2.33.

Now the 2.33 multiplier is in the first round of missile and I still miss him in rounds 1 and 2, just like before.

What the heck am I missing? My archer is now .78 but that should not matter that much to constantly miss.

> Do RoBF and DBs stack together?

Yes, but it's a level-based stack not effect-based.

> My archer is now .78 but that should not matter that much

Remember that's a penalty to DX _and_ PTH so it matters a lot.

Awesome changes, all around!

Ok,
I got my archery to 1.0 by using a smaller TSA.

I still miss Conundrum in rounds 1/2 of missile, hit in rounds 3/4 for at least 2 times each round----Just like before the changes. With the new changes I should hit in rounds 1/2 also.

Again, I still miss Hubbell in all rounds of missile combat.

My EC should take care of their defensive dex with the new multipliers, at least in rounds 3/4 vs Hubbell. My PTH on my bow and arrows should counter their minus PTH from evasion. So I should get max dex hits which is 1.5 per round.

So, can someone please explain why.

Jon: I don't think bows have a penalty to dex without Archery...at least not from what I've seen...

I am not seeing RoBF blocking AMF backsplash, didn't it used to protect against that? It would seem that if it protects against DD spells, it would also protect from backsplash of DD.

> I am not seeing RoBF blocking AMF backsplash, didn't it used to protect against that

Nope, AMF is a separate damage type.

It does protect against FB "friendly fire" though.

Wait, is everyone going to ignore THIS:
"Warrior Priest of Sigmar decapitated Guardian [69407544]"

Um, his most powerful blow is over 70 mil, so I don't think that was a joke

I am also not seeing any RoBF immolation during ranged. If it is active damage should it not be in force during ranged rounds in which I am taking active damage?

That was fixed promptly.

No UC love ? :)

Great changes so far, though it made me regret further to have abandoned using tattoos hehe Would love to use a RoBF on my UC guy :)

> If it is active damage should it not be in force during ranged rounds

No.

nice changes jon!

Thank you, Jon. :D Awesome changes!

ummm maybe a small bug with the RoBF, in a fight with Poisons character NWO I get

Noise's Magic Missile hit Spite for no damage.

next round I get

Chaos's familiar's Magic Missile hit Spite [32481624]

is that right?

Loving the new RoBF :) Thanks Jon.

Odd since it only appears to happen with NWO

Chaos's familiar's Magic Missile hit Spite [45675132]
Chaos's familiar's Magic Missile hit Wrath [23569724]

Hubbell Man's familiar's Magic Missile hit Wrath [347001]
Hubbell Man's familiar's Magic Missile hit Wrath [346479]

NWO's AoF screws everything up, just posting this to let people know.

Aof/junction bugged....
Essence's familiar's Magic Missile hit Itbuck [80597] with a level 13k Steel familiar

"added MM and CoC to list of damage reductions (besides FB, this already included exploding shot and other TBFs)"

I really think this should have ben to physical damage, not magical.

Do we really need another form of flat magical damage reduction? Isn't the MgS and EH enough? Where's the flat physical damage reduction?

I see what you mean, but I doubt the RoBF would make much a difference vs. most melee weapons... biggest RoBF now would only stop 600k damage.

WOW

my 1.6 mil RoBF is pumping out over 300k damage a round. Crazy!

This change so benefits Todd.

The RoBF?

C'mon

fixed focus w/ DD familiars (forgot to divide the percent by 100 :)

Both hurrah and aw crap! Time to re-do the weapon testing portion that was done on the BoNE. *grins* but I am happy to do it with this new buff for it! ^_^ Yay! That is, if I can find time for it....life has gotten so hectic lately. =\

love most of the changes...now just gotta work around the fact that RoBF now kills my mm on almost 1/5 of the people in my fight list!

Why don't the RoBF and DB stack like weapon PTh and the ToA do?

Better yet, why don't weapon PTH and TOA stack like DB and Evasion do?

items are supposed to stack by effect...

This what sucked 25% out of my belegs ? They don't seem to be moving back up at all .

Good catch Novice and NS.

Also, how does the evasion from an AoI figure into the realtionship?

I'm considering a sinlge minion. AoI, RoBF and DB for physical reduction via evasion, and RoBF, AMF for magic. ;)

MM's Magic Missile hit Tygrana for no damage

i think the damage reduction done by the RoBF is now just a tad too much.
I can't hit him in ranged for no damage what so ever with a 800k mm.

sorry for the double post, but the RoBF still doesnt give any good protection vs bows in ranged other then the evasion.

Lucifer cast Antimagic Field on MM (0.00)
Lucifer cast Antimagic Field on Decay/AS's familiar (0.07)
Lucifer cast Antimagic Field on Decay/AS (0.98)

MM takes damage from his own Magic Missile (0)!
MM's Magic Missile hit Lucifer for no damage
Decay/AS's familiar takes damage from his own Magic Missile (8920)!
Decay/AS's familiar's Magic Missile hit Lucifer for no damage


Against this character: http://www.carnageblender.com/inspect_opponent.tcl?opponent_id=95666

900k max tat with a 1.2mil robf.
My MM and my SF hit him for nothing!
This thing is way way way way way to powerful now.

Is the RBF's damage reduction a cap type or a per hit type?

IE does it have a cap that once you overcome you do full damage, or does it reduce damage per hit by a %/set amount based upon its level?

From what I saw Ranger, you can absorb only a set ammount per battle and not just per round.

How is it overpowered? You're only recording the first round, the set amount of absorption can easily be finished off by the 2nd round.

Magic Missile hit John Sparrow [1235329]

Magic Missile hit John Sparrow [1397746]

R.I.P. John Sparrow

Magic Missile hit Gordon Gano [757851]

Magic Missile hit Gordon Gano [1473677]

This is with a 1.6 mil RoBF on Gordon

i think infact it should be increased to 30% ... considering it is all it has for the whole 25 rounds -.-

Or just an aura effect.

"you can absorb only a set amount per battle"

not true

Ok, I need a little clarification. Sometimes I block the entire damage from DD with my RoBF, other times, I get hit for pretty big damage both in ranged and melee. Below is an example battle. I seeing a 100% to 0% swing in damage blocked in any given round with the RoBF, what determines how much it blocks and when? (Is it random and you just hope you block some or all of the damage?)

** MrMunch Melee Rounds **

Peanut bruised Spiker [43]

Peanut bruised Spiker [60]
Peanut bruised Spiker [43]

Peanut tapped Spiker [65]

Peanut bruised Spiker [38]

Peanut tapped Spiker [43]
Peanut bruised Spiker [49]

Peanut bruised Spiker [45]

Peanut beat Spiker [33]

Peanut crushed Spiker [52]
Peanut pulverized Spiker [55]


** TherealSpiker Ranged Rounds **

Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut for no damage

Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut for no damage

Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut [316]

** TherealSpiker Melee Rounds **

Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (383)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut [510]

Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (401)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut for no damage

Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (456)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut for no damage


Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (424)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut for no damage

Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (536)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut [573]

Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (578)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut for no damage


Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (387)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut [532]

Spiker burns from the flames surrounding Peanut (504)
Spiker's Fireball hit Peanut [99]
R.I.P. Spiker

""you can absorb only a set amount per battle"

not true"

It used to be that way, yes? ie, before the change?

Yep.

IMO it has always been per round not per battle.

oic... so it pretty cool now :) yep so as it stands 20% is cool

Could the immolation damage be absorb by PL.

Ya the RoBF needs to be nerfed back down some. The active damage aura is pretty big, unavoidable, can't be absorbed by PL, immune to GA, difficult to reduce, etc. Way over the top.

It's reduced by AC, isn't it?

Must be, or else I'd hit for 280000 or so on every strike. Which rarely happens.

I say make the minion equipped with the RoBF take some damage from GA. That will obligate RoBF users to choose between DM to avoid GA damage or AMF to reduce DD damage. It would also obligate users to have use a decent amount of HP on the minion equipped with the RoBF.

> It used to be that way, yes? ie, before the change?

no, there has never been a per-battle cap on RBF damage (or anything other damage type that I can think of). no idea where that misinformation got started.

I think they're talking about the per battle cap on damage absorbed

hmm, I'm completely confused...

Is the RoBF DR similar to the ToE then?

> I think they're talking about the per battle cap on damage absorbed

either way, there's never been a per battle cap.

> Is the RoBF DR similar to the ToE then?

In the sense that there is no per-battle cap, definitely. :)

Against DD spells... yes.

I was replying to this statement: "Is the RoBF DR similar to the ToE then?"

"no, there has never been a per-battle cap on RBF damage (or anything other damage type that I can think of). no idea where that misinformation got started."

Looks like it came from Drakon(DS):
"Did study on RoBF and found info to be wrong"

I guess his study needed more studying....

So what exactly is the backlash damage done by a RoBF now?

Mine gives damage of about 23% of tattoo level per round against 0 AC.

:) Seems about right SP.

a coupel of fights versus zero AC folk and mines done between 20% and 25%

Rangers tattoo should therefore do around 1 million raw damage per round, that sounds reasonable to me.

The biggest RBF is Edyit's (Blessed Darkness lvl 3,053,860 owned by Adminedyit (Edyit)) which does this to me:


Johnny missed Wrath
Johnny burns from the flames surrounding Avarice (591980)

That's with me operating a (25) Protection as well...

Overpowered?

Seems like the RoBF is a little overpowered. Evasion plus reduction from DD spells and also active damage...

Oh, yes. Just a tad.

"added evasion bonus, roughly equivalent to the evasion added by a pair of DB at 1/3 the NW of the TBF"

This evasion bonus includes evasion dexterity?

"Oliver Thrace's Cone of Cold hit Memnarch for no damage"

Is the spell resistance on the RoBF maybe a wee bit high?

There has always been a reason the RBF sucked; the original concept was way too strong. Bring the tat nearer to that concept and BOOM a must have tattoo is born!

I don't need it :D

I have a tendency of staying away from all these fads, RoE, HoC :P

Hm. From what I've seen with my RoBF is that the evasion barely does anything... and basically you've got to stay alive until melee rounds for it to work...

As per the evasion on the RBF,

It is nice, do not get me wrong, but it is not something that should make the final decision whether or not to use it.

IE my evasion on my tank is: Evasion: 1,359,999/1,000,000 (127)

When I make my tattoo a RBF at 107M NW I notice very little benefit.

The one person that I fight who hits my tank consistently is Alchemist. Normally he will hit my tank in the first or second round of missile with his exbow. With my RBF on he hits just a tab less, about 25% less often in the first and second missile rounds. Not enough to really make a difference.

And really, about 700K per round form a 3 Million Tattoo isn't too bad.

So that just leaves the fixed Magic Damage Reduction.

Do we *really* need more Magic Damage reduction? AMF reduces first by a percent, then the RBF mops up with it's fixed amount.

Why not change the RBF to be the anti physical tattoo. Active damage, Evasion and a fixed reduction to physcial damage (after AC's percantage reduction, so Physical attackers can feel Mages pain).

I'm colossally out of touch with lower and intermediate levels of play, but at the high end the RoBF is the worst tattoo I have tried (even worse than Hal). If gives little to no protection, no backlash in ranged (still the big problem), and other magic teams could still eat me up faster than I could eat them (because of lacking the SF). Mind you, I am not re-tuning my entire team each time I try a different tattoo, but the RoBF seems far from some sort of ultimate thing to me. Can someone show a team that is riding a high score on a small PR using the RoBF? Can we get some hard facts here?

Sut, check out Ash's char This is MADNESS for a really good use of the RBF.

Just fix the evasion/minus to hit so it actually works and I'll be happy.

I'm still getting hit (sometimes in the first round) by MsK users with no archery with DB+92/AoI/1.6 mil RoBF

that's 112 minus to hit plus what SHOULD be another 80-90...

the RoBF isn't the problem, the MgS is the problem...even the person who is responsible for its (and all supporter items) power (Sut) thinks it's a cruel joke...

lol@novice.

JW, yes, "This is MADNESS" has a nice score/PR ratio. So does TrueDevil's "CodeGeass" (with no tattoo at all, I might add).

I'm still not seeing the advantage of the RoBF in that it doles out no damage in ranged. That means, by and large, it will still be owned by large ranged magic and ToA archers. And against ToE folks, it will be a battle of attrition (not sure which is better there). Also, it has no aura, so unless it is used all by itself in one of these passive-damage stances, it is hard to find a place for it. Would a mage give up a CoI and body armor to wear one of these? What would be the point of putting it elsewhere? I guess it works well on a wall, but again eats the body armor/cloak slots, thereby making the wall not much like a wall...

I would also say Ash has a large score because he knows how/who to fight. *smile*

The RoBF has a lot of nice bullet points and seems conceptually powerful, but that doesn't mean it is over-powered or some sort of catch-all item... It can just finally hold its own in certain stances.

Ash has a broad spectrum of people on his fightlist, including me, G Beee's big archer char The Tweenies, and Bart's 2.5 million MPR char B Ark. So, not only is the char the bearer of a good score/mpr ratio; it's also a very effective fighter.

I don't think it's overpowered either Sut, it's just effective in certain circumstances. Finally!

But yes, it seems like it's best use is as the main damage dealer; on any other team that already has a main damage dealer there are plenty of other tattoos that work as well and, mostly, better.

I'd love to see some fight logs to see how he is winning against a big archer.

Big evasion; and then wearing them down with the RBF. It takes him fifteen rounds to beat me; I don't get in a hit.

It is the number 2 evasion in the game.....

Yes, his Evasion is very large (which has nothing to do with the RoBF, really). *smile* He could convert the RoBF to an SF and probably still do well. What the RoBF helps with is not getting nuked by AMF, so that is definitely an advantage.

His team even still has a couple things he could easily add, such as a decent MgS on the second minion. That would help even more against MM and leave more HP for melee.

Don't get me wrong, it is good to see the RoBF stand on its own as far actually being a viable choice. The RoBF is now like a magic familiar, except it is immune to AMF, has some damage reduction qualities, but doesn't serve as a kill slot. Is that a fair summary? In fact, one could liken it very much to an IF, in that it needs to make it to melee to be worthwhile, but it cannot benefit from an HoC (or can it?) Would be a neat if the active damage fired a round sooner with an HoC. *smile*

His Evasion is definitely high for his total PR (and smartly so). That is probably why he is able to find some nice targets, with the RoBF doling out the pain giving him folks like B Ark.

ac seems to be the counter. this may make people decide whether to fill their armor slots with effects, or with ac. seems like more rock, paper, scissors...the meat of cb.

i revamped my whole team around it, got my evasion up to 154 and bumped hp up to 3 mill. i now have the largest ga in the game as well as increasing my dm. i lost as many people as i added to my fightlist and my score has remained constant for now.

what i do notice is that some people are stalemating, drawing or losing to me occasionally now that use to farm me mercilessly. perhaps i will be farmed less, that remains to be seen though.

i do like it better than dd, i felt quite under powered for my mpr with dd and in no way feel overpowered now. i do not feel quite so much like a farm for multi minion teams much lower than me, even though that is still taking place somewhat but not on the same scale.

The benefit of the RBF is that you get no retaliation from it, and EO's have no effect.

EC doesn't lower it, nor does AMF (and you also don't get backlashed from it) and you don't take GA from it.

You could theoretically stick it on a 20 HP AoI minion and have that minion live forever, dealing damage every round, until the Amulet stops providing its Invisiblity.

Spread Damage could kill a minion like this. But that's where your own AMF and the absorption of the RBF comes in. Use this as the first minion in a 4 minion team and MM has to eat through a MgS Wall, before reaching you, CoC and FB get reduced, diluted then absorbed. And Decay *can't* kill you.

Hell, Trian a massive evasion, use DB/EB and the RBF and leave it as the Archer target.

It's the *only* way to stack as much Evasion as possible.

Skill, Amulet (AoI would only work if all your minions wear one...), Boots and Tattoo. That's everything.

"Spread Damage could kill a minion like this. But that's where your own AMF and the absorption of the RBF comes in. Use this as the first minion in a 4 minion team and MM has to eat through a MgS Wall, before reaching you, CoC and FB get reduced, diluted then absorbed. And Decay *can't* kill you. "


Don't forget it protects against the SoD too. Chuck an AoI on a RBF minion and place him in the middle of a wall/PL team and you could be dishing out the dirt for a very long battle.

and with the 20% increase to BoNE and ELS, what is the new break point in AC for when a VB becomes better than either?

I believe the RoBF has a little too much going for it. RoBF should be similar to CB1's CoBF, where it dealt splash damage to friendly minions (aside from the minion wearing it of course). This should make it more balanced.

I've tested the RoBF and it is working great. The evasion granted is not sufficient to avoid being hit by tanks so it is pretty balance on that part. The damage reduction is a little too effective but since it is only on the minion wearing it, I guess its pretty ok.

Just to clear up an ambiguity:

"ToE endurance on equipping minion is now 50% of lvl (was 60%); aura is now 40% (was 35%)"

Does this mean the aura is 40% of level or 40% of the effect of the equipping minion.

Good question...