AoF boosts familiar DD (in Changelog)
February 22 2008 2:41 PM EST
After I saw this thread, I checked the AoF/Junction announcement and saw that I never mentioned that when junctioned to a DD familiar, AoF boosts DD instead of skills.
Well, it does, and has since AoF could be junctioned.
Sorry for the confusion. :)
February 22 2008 2:45 PM EST
Huh. That is supercool. :D
Umm uhh uhh wow.
February 22 2008 2:46 PM EST
O... M... G...
This is MADNESS. Good information :)
a feature then and not a bug.
is the beleg's issue also a feature or a bug?
I like it. Alot. does it increase DD by the same percentage?
February 22 2008 2:51 PM EST
Junction has gone from all time worst skill ever to right behind evasion. Woot.
February 22 2008 2:57 PM EST
Did a little testing, Fought Godsend with AoF+10 on my junction minion, amf casted for 11%. Fought Godsend without AoF+10 on my junction minion, amf casted at 11%. Is it a little too early for April fools? -_-
February 22 2008 3:01 PM EST
dudemus - I hope so much that's a bug...
Indeed... I am 100% certain that the AoF increases the spell level, but I have seen no evidence that the AoF increases the spell effect.
February 22 2008 3:09 PM EST
Hm...with the biggest AoL and the biggest AoF (assuming unnamed,) that'd increase novice's 4.2M IF to 6.5M due to a 53% increase in DD...now that would be nice. O_O
Plus the extra amount if the items happened to be named. Closer to 6.6M.
February 22 2008 3:12 PM EST
> I am 100% certain that the AoF increases the spell level, but I have seen no evidence that the AoF increases the spell effect.
they are both increased
Ulord: remember it also increases AMF effect
February 22 2008 4:08 PM EST
ah it makes sense. Thanks novice.
February 22 2008 4:11 PM EST
Wait a minute.
You telling me that every plus an the AoF increases DD by 3%?
If so, can the AoF bonus be lowered to 2% like initially posted?
3% is quite powerful.
doesn't help a bit if you can't live through the (still) silly damage of the MsK
well amf is increased to the same amount. Non amf users may have some problems tho :)
February 22 2008 4:15 PM EST
> You telling me that every plus an the AoF increases DD by 3%?
only on familiars.
February 22 2008 4:18 PM EST
Use you DBs, then we will see.
You may be surprised.
February 22 2008 4:19 PM EST
I guess this is another hit for the poor Halidon familiar.
Also, boosting AMF by 3% is about 47% short of being the equivalent of boosting DD by 3%. My 1.5M AMF throws back about 10% of the damage from 3M DDs out there.
February 22 2008 4:46 PM EST
I may be biased but I think 3% boost is fair, only because of another overpowered item: mage shield. Again, I might be biased :)
February 22 2008 6:18 PM EST
Wow, holy crap I can make my familiar throw a fireball! I rented a +10 AoF:
Joe takes damage from his own Fireball (565075)!
Joe's Fireball hit Kano-san 
Hubbell Man's familiar takes damage from his own Fireball (798037)!
Hubbell Man's familiar's Fireball hit Kano-san 
Kano-san is a rather large JKF. It is clear his endurance is being entirely overwhelmed by my familiar. A later battle had the familiar hitting him for over 2 million.
Joe is a straight mage. He has a 0.37 AMF on him in this case. Hubbell Man's familiar has a 0.36 AMF on him. I knew his DD was more powerful (Mage Seeker Bow has been telling me that for some time), but I had no idea this was how powerful he was. His augmentation comes from:
-- Fully junctioned AGs
-- AoF at +10 (so I guess a whopping 30% just from that)
-- Amulets of Leadership in effect on lead minion, both are at +9.
Judging by the similar AMFs (0.37 and 0.36), the backlash can be used as very informative. The familiar is getting boost from the AoF, AoLs and AGs, but Joe is getting boost from AGs and a big CoI... Let me add up some numbers...
Base DD Level: 4,341,702
CoI: +18 = 18%
AGs +15 = 15%
(that's it, AoL does not help him, since he is already in front)
TOTAL AUGMENTATION: 33%
TOTAL EFFECT: 5,774,463 (corresponds with training screen)
Base DD Level: 4,943,724
AoF: +10 = 30%
TOTAL AUGMENTATION: 54%
TOTAL EFFECT: 7,613,335 (wow, I will never catch that! *smile* The highest base attribute in the game is just shy of 5 million.)
Everything involved is named, so I am just canceling that all out.
Ratio of mage's total effect to familiar's total effect: 0.758467.
Ratio of mage's backlash to familiar's: 0.708081.
Second ratio is a bit lower because AMF on the familiar is a tad bit lower. That makes the reduction of his DD less, so the numbers appear to be pretty darn correct. Not sure why I thought they wouldn't be, but it is always good to crunch some ints. *smile*
I can understand the AoF idea -- since it can't aid the Junction itself, help aid what the junctioned familiar is doing. In this case, that's DD.
For the AoF effect, 3% per seems like a lot per +. HOWEVER, considering that such augmentation only makes the Familiar's Achilles Heels (plural) worse, maybe that's fair? Jacking up the DD on the familiar makes it more prone to insta-death via mage-seeker, and makes AMF backlash blows greater (I know that a higher DD yields greater results in the long run against AMF, but if the familiar is dead, he's dead...) In other words, it gets DAMN hard to protect such an offensive asset. AS is the only way, and there is enough DM out there to make that somewhat less palatable. Tough choices.
February 22 2008 6:25 PM EST
Sorry, I had to share this:
Against King of Pain's team (now new and improved with RoBF!):
Joe's Fireball hit Stewart for no damage
Joe's Fireball hit Sting , Andy 
Hubbell Man's familiar's Fireball hit Stewart for no damage
Hubbell Man's familiar's Fireball hit Sting , Andy 
Hubbell Man's Decay hit Stewart 
Stewart has no AC, no MgS, and there is no AMF hlding back that 7 million+ effective fireball (though it is spread between three minions).
Jonathan, we once sparred a bit on a thread about how much I disliked the flat-reduction items in the game... Can you kinda see why that might be? Even diluted three ways, a 7 million+ attribute being rendered entirely useless?
Sute, can you do me a favour and check the AMF backlashes your familiar recives both with an without the AoF? I just want to check if the negative increase to AMF with the AoF is carrying over to a 1.00 Junctioned Familiar. ;)
February 22 2008 8:32 PM EST
AMF Effect = 0.36
Backlash (round 1) = 564,309
AMF Effect = 0.36
Backlash (round 1) = 434,145
Same AMF effect. AMF does not junction through, apparently. So, less DD means less offensive power, but AMF effect is the same.
Really, no downside at all to putting an AoF on your junctioner. 30% DD enhancement? Amazing.
Gordon Gano's familiar's Cone of Cold hit heat 
February 22 2008 9:56 PM EST
That's pain :/ Did you pick up any new targets novice?
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