DX - an almost useless strat ? (in General)

Sickone July 5 2008 7:24 PM EDT

I took advantage this "free retrain week" in trying out various proportions of HP/ST/DX, and also rented a HUGE x weapon too.

So far, it appears like DX is practically pointless in the long run - the only thing you can marginally counteract is enemy DX, because you really don't get a chance against enemy evasion, and even there, the weapon "plus to-hit" NW is the only one really affecting things.

IMHO, currently, DX seems to be a mostly useless stat - I have managed to maintain my fight list almost identical by cutting down ALL of my "naturally trained" DX and pushing it into HP and ST ; also, by adding more DX at the detriment of HP or ST hasn't managed to gain me any new opponents either.

Does anybody else feel like something is really, really wrong here with DX ?

Sickone July 5 2008 7:25 PM EDT

typo : "stat" instead of "strat"

Also, I do have a ToA that grants me about 900k DX (and a lot of NW on weapon +).

Yukk July 5 2008 9:27 PM EDT

I've found that DX is pretty useless too. As you said, any mage with 6M defensive DX from Evasion is out of any tank's league. Training 6M DX on the tank would just make it worse unless you have the matching +250 weapon. Even then, you could just drop the DX to 20 and put the XP into ST and let the weapon do the talking.
Jon did increase the natural chance to hit from DX, but that only affects attacks on non-evasion minions because evasion can only be battled by huge weapons.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] July 5 2008 9:30 PM EDT

Imagine if Every Tank dropped thier DEX to 20, and all the Mages retrained thier 6M Evasions back into DD...

three4thsforsaken July 5 2008 10:04 PM EDT

Dex is fine, it is the barrier between the single hit or double hit. Believe it or not Dex does help hit some minions, like other tanks or even evasion minions (although it is often hopeless).

Wizard'sFirstRule July 5 2008 10:15 PM EDT

I like the way AMF curve works. You get a linear (very steep) growth curve as you start training AMF vs DD, then it gets harder to completely negate it. Maybe tank hits could use similar curve and require only 1/3 DX to guarentee a hit. That might make evasion less good.

three4thsforsaken July 5 2008 10:51 PM EDT

the reason AMF curves at it does because, first of all, DD is difficult to boost. Nothing compared to dex. 2nd of all it has backlash (backlash is the sole reason my previous CoC team staled) backlash goes past all defenses in a multi minion team and often can deal the mage.

Apples and oranges I feel. DD always hits, but weapons can double hit.

Wizard'sFirstRule July 5 2008 10:54 PM EDT

at least give melee weapon to-hit a 5% minimum regardless of how far evasion drops it? so a new user with a dagger +0 and 20 DX will have 5% chance of hitting a evasion tank in melee?

three4thsforsaken July 5 2008 11:03 PM EDT

why would someone you can hit 5% of the time ever be on your fightlist? If you need to get evasion shields out of the way, train the shiney new EF! or use SG! Or Halidon! Or rent! or get a loan!

Sickone July 6 2008 11:11 AM EDT

I giggled at the EC ability description a bit...

"Decreases targets' ST and DX. Besides the obvious advantages when they attempt to strike you, EC can help your own Minions achieve double or triple strikes thanks to the EC-caused DX gap."

Well, if you do know your formulae, you should know that if the weapon has no enchant "+" on it at all, the best you can hope for is double hits out of an 1.0 archery ELB, with 1h melee weapons getting at best a 60% chance for a second strike and 2h melee weapons getting a puny 40% chance for a second strike "thanks to the DX gap".
There's absolutely no chance whatsoever for a third hit from the DX gap alone.

QBsutekh137 July 6 2008 11:34 AM EDT

I think the description assumed some amount of + on the weapon as well, so 1-2 hits from natural dexterity, plus whatever additional chance from +.

However, the whole description is still a bit antiquated considering Evasion and DB's role in the current game-scape.

QBRanger July 6 2008 12:45 PM EDT

Right now, with evasion's superboost from the AOF, tanks can almost never try to get a dex CTH.

However, in tank vs tank battles, dexterity is quite formidable.

One just has to be careful with what your trying to accomplish with it.

Windwalker July 6 2008 12:48 PM EDT

Have to agree. Dumped all my dexterity and split it between HP and ST. Raised my ENC.millions!Did not lose one off my fight list. Hmmm.

Sickone July 6 2008 1:41 PM EDT

Yup, with a ToA, all the DX you get from it is usually enough (or you just need a little bit extra, negligible compared to HP/ST anyway), and by redirecting all those levels into ST/HP you raise your encumbrance a lot, which means not only you last longer (HP), but you deal more damage (ST) and can raise your chance to hit much higher (weapon + NW).

Even in tank-vs-tank combat, what's the point of having double vs half DX if all you can get from that is at best one extra hit, but all of those levels put into HP and/or ST can easily boost your overall damage and survivability higher ?

DX right now is more of a liability than something useful past a certain very low point - you just keep a small amount of it (so you can't say you have none), and that's it.
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