Forging --A Conversation (in General)


ScY March 26 2009 7:22 PM EDT


<TheHatchetman> and if i nearly double my MPR (go to 4m MPR), I get a whopping 11.3% increase :P
* ScY thinks jon needs to give forging some love
<Warlord_Zenai_{CB1}> admitted
<Warlord_Zenai_{CB1}> Forging needs a few buffs
<Admiralkiller> If i forge do i gain levels or xp to help myself forge better in the future?
<ScY> you gain nothing
<TheHatchetman> nope
<ScY> only money
<TheHatchetman> you gain some net worth, and even that costs you money :P
<ScY> (or lose money if you are forging for yourself)
<Admiralkiller> well mabey he should make it so the more u forge the better u get at it
<ScY> and make it more profitable
<Warlord_Zenai_{CB1}> has been said already....lol
<Warlord_Zenai_{CB1}> ppl have even gone to the trouble of saying add the exp feature to it as well
<ScY> if you can fight and gain exp but make the same $$$ as forging, where you only gain money (from doing work for others)
<ScY> you dont need to necessarily make exp
<ScY> since it is an economic activity, why not make it better for the wallet
<Warlord_Zenai_{CB1}> true i simply said that it has been said that is all
<ScY> meaning you can forge more NW with less BA
<Admiralkiller> yea some silly formula
<ScY> at a given mpr
<TheHatchetman> there is a tradeoff in there though
<ScY> hardly
<ScY> you make slightly more forging than you do fighting, while sacrificing 100% of your exp
<Admiralkiller> .002 x X to the factor of 3 + score-Pr or something
<TheHatchetman> forging at 75%, I make ~8-10% more by forging than by fighting, furthermore, I make an additional 400k+ /week by renting out my gear that I don't need to use while im forging
<ScY> right
<ScY> while sacrificing 100% of your growth
<ScY> (except for defensive wins)
<ScY> but that is negligable
<TheHatchetman> growth of what? a disposable character? (another issue with CB)
<ScY> well, thats just the system
<ScY> but still
<ScY> you spend your BA fightn9g to grow and make money
<Tyriel> Tattoo, too.
<ScY> yup
<TheHatchetman> i don't currently own any character that can be thought of as "competative", so saccrificing growth is the same as saccrificing gas mileage on the car I don't have :P
<ScY> now when forging you spend your exp on 8-10% more money
<ScY> hardly
<ScY> you can make a NCB and gain money and exp
<ScY> +be competitive
<ScY> but that requires BA that you choose (and I do) to spend forging



As you can see from above: a conversation about forging not being all that great at the moment. The conversation speaks for itself.

BUFF FORGING PLZ

Newlin [SeeD] March 26 2009 7:39 PM EDT

I think that giving a boost to forging would be beneficial to everyone. On one level it would allow the forger to forge more efficiently and make more money. Plus it would also encourage more people to forge so it would create competition between forgers to lower their rates and make it cheaper for people who are fighting.

Adi March 26 2009 7:44 PM EDT

The disadvantages forgers face are glaring. Maybe Jon is trying to discourage forging in order to encourage more fighting characters? Just a thought.

chaosal March 26 2009 7:48 PM EDT

that's a good point- if the combat is the purpose of CB, then forging is just a time-waster for people who get tired of fighting and what benefits there are would just be bonus. on the other hand, if Jon feels it's a significant part of the game, forging could be balanced, as well as potentially branching into other side-games...

/daydream

three4thsforsaken March 26 2009 8:09 PM EDT

I think forging was definitely viable earlier when the rewards were smaller. I don't think Jon is making a point against forging as much as the game simply outgrew the pace of forging.

.. March 26 2009 8:28 PM EDT

I don't see how you can get more from forging than fighting if you are fighting at a 100% Challenge bonus.

AdminTitan March 26 2009 9:05 PM EDT

Two things:

1. Without NUB you gain more NW forging than money you do fighting. Start charging more if you want more money, or forge your own stuff.

2. I don't remember when Jon said this but, he said this isn't a game for forging. It's not suppose to be the only thing you do, it's suppose to be just another part, fighting should be the main part of the game. If I'm mistaken sorry, but I am fairly certain this is what he said.

Thank you.

ScY March 26 2009 9:27 PM EDT

Start charging more=less likely to get clients.

You make, as hatch stated in the conversation, roughly 8-10% more forging, assuming you consistently forge stuff that has good payouts.

As to the 'you get more NW forging' while this is true because your BA goes directly into your NW, most people either have enough money from their NUB to get people to forge for them, are already more or less set, or spend USD to quickly increase NW.

"
2. I don't remember when Jon said this but, he said this isn't a game for forging. It's not suppose to be the only thing you do, it's suppose to be just another part, fighting should be the main part of the game. If I'm mistaken sorry, but I am fairly certain this is what he said."

Right, so since you are 'supposed' to fight, that means that all the other options for activity in the game should not ever be used.

Then why have forging in the first place? Better yet, why is it listed in the advertisement for CB before you make an account under things you can do in the game?

Whether people, and Jon, like it or not, forging is a part of the game and provides a cheaper way to increase NW of items. If Jon didnt want people to forge, then why code it?

Point is, forging and forgers need some love from time to time. (Although to the best of my knowledge if it were buffed, that would be one of the only, if not *the* only time forging was buffed in my time at CB2)

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] March 26 2009 9:29 PM EDT

i also remember that he stated he never meant it as an alternate playstyle and that it was basically implemented as a way for non-usd spenders to be able to add nw to weapons. if that was the primary goal, i would say that it still meets those needs.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] March 26 2009 9:32 PM EDT

to clarify, i always took it to mean forging for oneself on that last part.

Kefeck [BlackSmith] March 26 2009 11:08 PM EDT

I dont see a buff, for the same reasons we wont see a "rune of money" of some sorts that grants extra percentages to your money. To much sellouts for usd, even if the rate has been terrible lately.

QBRanger March 26 2009 11:17 PM EDT

Just look at TheHatchetman.

He is forging his own items and is getting ready for a NCB run. At least that is what I was told.

Kefeck [BlackSmith] March 26 2009 11:21 PM EDT

He is forging his own items and is getting ready for a NCB run. At least that is what I was told.

For the most part your correct, although i do believe he's been forging for the public a wee bit.

Goodfish March 26 2009 11:39 PM EDT

Can anybody possibly imagine how sick I am of people demanding a forge buff...?

TheHatchetman March 26 2009 11:43 PM EDT

"Just look at TheHatchetman.

He is forging his own items and is getting ready for a NCB run. At least that is what I was told. "

I'm an example... Sweet ^_^


"For the most part your correct, although i do believe he's been forging for the public a wee bit. "

Gotta get my forging fees somehow, right? :P Oh, and I'm also paying AG to level my tat

QBRanger March 26 2009 11:45 PM EDT

Hatchy is doing it exactly as some of us believe Jon wanted.

And judging by his items, he is doing it very well. Almost as well as Sefton when he camped and fought.

PS: Cannot give you too much credit Hatch, that head is starting to swell.

BluBBen March 27 2009 2:59 AM EDT

Both Jon and NS want forging more competitive but they don't know how for sure.

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] March 27 2009 3:32 AM EDT

Look over a few of my past ideas in the zillions of threads for this topic and you'll find plenty of ways any sort of Buff for forgers could happen.

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] March 27 2009 3:36 AM EDT

And to the people that dont say anything but "No, no buffs for forgers" get out unless you have something relevant to say.

But to the people that say Jon didn't want it as a main object of the game, why is it still in the game? Someone said because it was a way for non-USD spenders to get higher NW, but wait, you need a high character to do that first right? You can't just choose to forge right off the bat, so technically that point is just moot. And NUBs, they have another 6 months from the day they join before they really should forge. So why is that the reason it's in the game if nobody really should be doing it when they join/need to fight before they even begin to forge.

I'm tired, this may not have been readable, I'm going to bed, I'll re-read the thread/posts tomorrow, =)

Fatil1ty March 27 2009 9:17 AM EDT

forging itself doesn't need a buff... it's more complicated than that. Forging takes 0 skill so it shouldn't be better than a decent strategy at making money however I see one MAJOR change that would greatly benefit the game:

Make forging much more related to MPR!!! The char market in CB is so sad considering how much work people put into the characters. If the gap between forging at 1M MPR and 2M was something like 50% then honestly it would make forging worthwhile while also giving the character market a majorly needed value boost

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] March 27 2009 9:24 AM EDT

EDITing my previous post:

And to the people that dont say anything but "No, no buffs for forgers" get out unless you have something relevant to say.

But to the people that say Jon didn't want it as a main object of the game, why is it still in the game? Someone said because it was a way for non-USD spenders to get higher NW, but wait, you need a high character to do that first right? You can't just choose to forge right off the bat, so technically that point is just moot. And NUBs, they have another 6 months from the day they join before they really should forge. So why is that the reason it's in the game if nobody really should be doing it when they join/need to fight before they even begin to forge, plus forge was put in before NUB/NCB, back when your original character was the only one you could even imagine catching up and competing with. SO it was either fight or forge, there was to forge your own NW to start a new character and catch #1.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] March 27 2009 11:33 AM EDT

this has likely been brought up before, but if jon truly wants to make forging a bit more competitive, why not give discounts on forge fees for the top five forgers much like the top fighting clans get the clan bonus.

Underage Drinking [Battle Royale] March 27 2009 12:34 PM EDT

NO FORGING BUFF PLZ

Ive certainly done my fair share of forging. Forging right now is as it should. Forging is not competitive, its work. So then you still want to be competitive, join a clan! grow BIGGER! forge BIGGER! ^_~

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] March 27 2009 2:31 PM EDT

It's not competitive because there is no reason to BE COMPETITIVE. Give us a reason for it TO BE COMPETITIVE and you will see competition, why is there a list of the top forgers for 24 hours/Week/Month/Year? Not competitive? Please, that's the only reason I see that there is a list existing in CB for forgers. But what does it help, like similar lists DO for fighters? Nothing. Make it worth forgers while to be on that list.

QBRanger March 27 2009 2:34 PM EDT

I still see no reason Forgers do not get a bonus to their abilities if their clan is in the top xxx.

Or during bonus money time. Make forging 60% more efficient during that time and 60% less during xp time.

QBOddBird March 27 2009 2:36 PM EDT

Yeah, forging wacky times would be pretty cool.

Then again, another forging buff period would be cool. The indirect buff via econ clans was really nice and needed, but it doesn't mean forging is at all up to par.

Fatil1ty March 27 2009 4:05 PM EDT

it seems my reply was ignored:

why not just make the boosts based on MPR something worthwhile: for example a 50% bonus to effectiveness if you're double the MPR. It would also increase character resale prices which are embarissingly low for how much work they require.
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