Need strat help. (in General)

I'm going to be hiring soon. Possibly after next changemonth. Though I haven't fleshed out a perfect strategy yet. I have a few ideas, but they all have fairly large weakness. Please help tweaking any you like.

I have two minions. Big minion has 24 million levels. Small minion has 2.7 million levels. All stated levels are raw.

Feel free to suggest strats but note that I don't do USD. Hiring will clean out ALL my money. So that means no huge weapons, no huge DBs.

Strat 1:

Big minion:

4 million dex
4 million evasion
16 million HP
RoBF,MgS,EB,EG,AoF

Small minion:

2.7 million AMF
enchanter gear

pros: tank immunity (maybe 250 evasion), extreme (more than 50%) DD damage reduction, GA no effect
cons: RoBF takes too long to kill. Weak against walls.

Strat 2:

small minion:
2.7 million UC

Jiggy, HGs, EB, HoE, AoJ

Big minion:
10 million HP
14 million CoC

BoE, CoI, HoC, NSC, DBs, AoI

pros: decent ranged protection (190 evasion), incredible firepower
cons: questionable surviability against many teams. Including GA.


Strat 3:

small minion
2.7 million AMF
AoI,BoF, Corn, BoE

Big minion:
4 million dex
3 million evasion
8 million SG
9 million HP

RoBF, AoF, NSC, EBs, HoC

Pros: high evasion, RoBG + SG is strong firepower, good amf protection
Cons: low HP, weak against MM


More to come!

Please comment on the above strats or suggest your own. I do not want any specialist strats because the exp capabilities of this character can be much better.

Strats must take advantage of single minion exp concentration (huge EOs don't do that).

ummm I like the first one but you're right it may take too long to do enough damage. a base decay and NSC on the second minion would help a lot.

2.7M levels of AMF with a +10 corn vs +15 named NSC will give about .10 AMF.

Not that much.

I really dislike your setup number 1, for personal reasons, but it is quite sound.

Perhaps, just perhaps lower your HP to 12M and make a 4M AMF. You should not use a corn due to its 10% dex/skill penalty, however it will help a bit vs AMFs.

Having those 2 AMF's together, will give you an AMF of .30. A much better situation. Vs tanks you likely will not be hit as 4M dex and 4M evasion with a AoF and elven gear will get you into the 5M effective level range.

Those AMF numbers are vs about an 8M DD spell level.

Vs 10M DD level, those 2 AMFs I suggested will give about .26 AMF.

Of the three I think the first is best. Most tanks seem to have stopped worrying about dex. A thought occurs though, if you spend that much money on DBs for your familiar how much evasion would you get?

Likewise, I hope you'd try keeping the same strategy you are using already before retraining, just to see if it's still effective. One other strategy to consider is something like Mikel's strat with the RoBF. The first one but a bit more AMF and GA.

And make sure to save 150k for renaming!

How bout this.

Small Minion

2.7M HP

Large DBs, AoI and an MgS

Large minion

23M HP
1M PL
EC, EBs, EGs, AoF, TSA and an MgS (for MM)

I think this would work ok, depending on how large your DBs combined with the RoBF's small evasion and the AoI you could reduce people, even ones like Ranger and vectoidz to two hits, maybe 1 in the first couple rounds of ranged. Pretty nice when you'll be regenerating 700k per round.

Ranger, the purpose of the AMF is not to reduce damage greatly. The purpose is simply to stop decay, as I have a MgS on the big minion.

MgS + RoBF reduction will stop about 50% DD damage BEFORE amf is applied. The truth is, there really isn't much else the small minion can contribute other than a little more reduction and backlash damage.

Cube, I can't afford to go into a NW battle, because I don't do USD. It is important that my evasion guarantees zero hits because, 0 damage is much less than...anything? With that much evasion and dex (5 mil dex and 3 mil evasion) I'll have approximately 7 million effective levels in dex and Evasion. That's like a half billion CBD pair of DBs. Ranged modifiers make it kind of funny.


Art, many have suggested just spamming HP, but I'm not sure it's as good as reducing damage with less Hp. Besides I can't afford big DBs after hiring.

"Besides I can't afford big DBs after hiring."

Ahh, dang, that's really important. Too bad you can't hire two minions, and still have enough money for a pair of large DBs. I could think of some really interesting strategies if you had about 400M CB to spend :P.

If you want to just stop decay learn a 100k AMF.

Use the other levels in PL/HP with a TSA.

no thanks. Why would I want a TSA PL on a less than 2 million HP minion? More AMF would contribute more than anything else. When a mage is whittling away at you for 20 rounds, every little backlash and damage reduction helps.

Besides, I wouldn't want a team actually training a larger decay and taking out bug chunks of my 16 mil hp would I?

AMF is the best choice. 10% reduction isn't shabby at all, an most people don't have 8 mil DD anyway.

Yeah, I would go for the first one.

Ranger is suggesting to make it like Mikel. The large minion has a lot of HP and PL and a TSA. Then you have AMF & GA trained on the big minion, some AMF on the little minion. Then put the RoBF on the brand new minion.

I think Ranger's right in saying if you go for AMF go for a large amount because of NSC. 10% reduction isn't great, when you could be getting 10% more HP.

Why not just ignore the amf altogether? if you have a minion with 20 hp then decay isn't an issue, put the robf on the smaller minion, put him in front and train half dex half evasion, with your equips. Then on your larger minion train 22 mil hp and 2 mil pl.

having a big weakness is a good thing, that means it is good against all other strategies.

Ryuzaki, if I do that, I lose tank immunity. The point is not to get hit, ever.

The thing is, moving a MgS off the main minion loses out on 30% damage reduction. AMF can't copy that.

You guys have to remember that the MgS and the RoBF give 50% damage reduction. That's a ton. With 16 million HP they need to do at least 32 million effective damage to take me down.

Swapping things around to get TSA regen isn't as good as you would think. Especially if you are giving up tank immunity and a HUGE amount of DD damage reduction. How many rounds does it take for a TSA to regen 100% of your health? 33 rounds. Not worth it at all.


TSA regen isn't as good as the 50% damage reduction from DDs and the 100% damage reduction against tanks. It isn't actually that good period.

No,

I know full what what I am saying.

I believe the build I proposed will be slightly better for all around battle.

I do like your build a lot. A real lot. You have one thing nobody in the game has, and it is extremely valuable. You just have to use it right.

I think 2.7M levels of AMF is a waste of xp in the benefit/expenditure ratio.

Either have it just high enough to stop decays from 99% of CB. As most use a base one. Or have it high enough to actually help. Between 100k and 4M is a no man's land for AMF where you fight. Most DD spells that will matter are over 8M levels. Let us be realistic. With your tattoo, MgS and RBF, you will not take 16M for a long time unless their level is very high.

Remember the MgS helps vs RBF damage.

If you do not want a HP/TSA minion then what about all EC. 3.2M levels of EC (corn) will really stop almost every tank as none have over 5M dex.

Then have 500k levels of AMF on your main character with all the other stats you posted. Just 500k less hp.

It is how I would do things, after testing once I bought that minion. At least the ideas I would try first if I had your character.

You're right I did forget the magic reduction.

The MgS point is moot though because in either case you'd have a Mage Shield.

So it's 3% per round or 25% magic reduction.

3% is 480k per round, so it depends if you'll be taking more or less than 2 million per round in DD damage after the MgS and Amf reduction.

That's MgS + RoBF + AMF reduction.

Ranger, I'm not so sure.

I do see merit in you point that 4 mil AMF isn't that powerful. And that other stat investments might have a more apparent benefit.

However, at the bare least. I don't think a PL battery with something like 1.5-2million hp is the answer.

Chances are it'll die, and since it lack any form of damage reduction, and possess minimal HP regen.

I don't know. Another stat I can consider is GA. With that much damage reduction MM and SG should do less than 1 million which puts me in a great setup in a battle of attrition. Assuming DM isn't involved of course.

However, I still feel dumping into AMF fills in the holes that is mages in this strat the best. It'll help, not as much as most are comfortable with, but it'll probably buy me more rounds than a PL battery would give.

My thinking is that CoC is a potential problem once melee starts.

Some of the high level ones can do 2+M damage a round.

Having a 2.7M minion with some regeneration also using a MgS in the back will be very helpful.

Stopping a few rounds of MM and cutting the damage of the CoC in 1/2 each round it manages to still live. FB is not that damaging comparatively but can do some nice solo minion damage.

In back, it will not help vs SG of course.

I would not go GA as I personally hate using all ED spells due to DM. Just hate using something I cannot count on all the time. The only exception would be do defeat a particular opponent.

Like I stated, just how I would try things with your character. You have a great plan though.

Haha, you got me.

The biggest weakness of this strat is CoC, I was wondering who would point it out.

I have no protection against a huge IF backed up with leadership. This is the main reason this strat is sub par, I don't have enough AMF or GA to give a IF the run for it's money.

I've seen Nov deal 10 million a round with Steeds. Even 16 mil HP won't go far against him.

"The biggest weakness of this strat is CoC, I was wondering who would point it out."

You have a huge IF, I was certain I wouldn't need to point it out.

when I say subpar, I mean not perfect.

With +40 MgS and 6.2M RBF vs a 9M IF. 104 AC with no AMF

Canti's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Dog [1888698]
Canti's familiar's Cone of Cold hit Dog [1493727]

So lets say you take 1.5M a round from a 9M CoC. With a 9M RBF.

16 M HP is 11 rounds to do damage.

You do about 2M a round subject to AC/MgS.

In those 11 rounds you can do up to 22M damage.

Not bad vs most of CB.

Have a 2nd minion with a MgS also, splitting the damage and you likely can last another 3-4 rounds. Meaning 6-8M more potential damage.

If you use a RBF, it is all about living long enough. I felt the 2.7M HP minion with some regeneration and a MgS, with or without PL, would let you moreso than 2.7M levels of AMF on a 20 hp minion.

My last post on the matter.

If you just count percentages, you can see what Ranger's saying too.
2.7 mil more in HP is a 17% increase in your 16 mil HP.
10% AMF will give you ~11% more survivability, but only versus magic damage.

No backlash of course, but you weren't going to deal too much with 10% AMF, and HP works on both magic and physical damage.

What tank is going to hit 7 million post bonus evasion and dex? At this point, only mages concern me.

Right,

No tank will hit you. So you have to consider only magic damage. I think 2.7M of AMF is like peeing in the wind, doing nothing vs those few high level DD spells that will really pose a problem to you.

Personally more HP to disperse the damage would be better.

17 is still bigger than 11

Why won't tanks hit him? Having 4m trained evasion levels isn't enough for him to evade upper tanks.

Both of those will be boosted to around 6M. That would give most archers only a 70% or so bth from the weapon, and around 30 or 40 or so pth advantage. So, only 110 or so cth, not too many double hits then.

first of all it's 7 mil post boost Op.

2nd of all, don't forget ranged modifiers Art.

AoF doesn't boost dexterity, and neither does the RoBF.

You'll get about 1 mil levels in evasion from the RoBF.
EBs and EGs will give you at most about 45% boost to Dexterity.
AoF will boost this for skills up to 80% ish.

To get 7 mil levels in each you'll need
4.8 mil in Dex
2.9 mil in Evasion

This is even less than he is estimating for, I'm not sure the effect on 7 mil evasion, but I imagine it's good enough to nullify most of tank damage.
Opvines, you get hit because you lack dex.

Evasion 8,664,136 4,922,805 254 202 -- I have all of those things 3/4 (EBs, AoF, EGs, and a larger RoBF) and tanks still hit me.

Dexterity: 112,792

without dex your evasion is only 60% effective. And Dex is high enough to deal with most dex CTH alone.

Yeah, that's something I'm working on right now. But I still don't think 4m evasion/4m dex is enough to stop upper tanks like Vectoidz and Ranger.

With SHD's Dexterity at 4,132,750 - 7 mil should give a nice dent into the bth and cth, and since his evasion will be working at full efficiency, he should get a better minus to hit than you.

Factoring in ranged boosts to evasion, and I think 3/4ths will get to melee, especially if he still has 16 mil HP. At the very least he'll give them a run for their money.

7 million could be anywhere from 250 to 300 effect. I really have no idea. I know 5.7 million evasion should have about 230 effect. 250 is the size of their weapon. Now multiply it during ranged rounds. By alot. Now note that I likely have a better dex ratio then them.

Good times!

I'd love to see the evasion proved useful.

I just moved some minions around. 9.5m is now my effective level in evasion which gives me 263. This is before the 60% reduction, hence why my total evasion in my post-battle stats is much lower. Anyway, 7m is nowhere close to 250, much less 300.

"Anyway, 7m is nowhere close to 250, much less 300."

Yeah, it's prolly around 220, where I guessed it to be in my scenario.

I probably should start graphing this out. NS's graphs are way off i guess.

If Artemis is right, and it very well looks like he might be, then your evasion even with the full dex requirement then your evasion effect will be around where mine is right now (223) with very little dex, although I guess you'll still have defensive dex which I lack. Anyway, it brings me back to my main point is you'll definitely still have to worry about tanks. ;P

Hey dude, the only weapon that'll hit would probably be Death cause it's a melee weapon.

Even if it isn't as good as I think it is. Ranged weapons cannot deal with ranged multiplier. Perhaps on the last round of ranged I'll get hit. Once. Hardly a threat with this HP.

So no. I'm good with tanks. Better than pretty much anyone else in CB.

I just corrected the multipliers in the wiki. Should start at x2.2 and decrease by .24 each round. If they are working as intended, you should be fine versus Ranger and Vectoidz.

Actually, I just tested it early like I said and moved some equipment and minions around. I had Orange Lantern as my first minion and had a total of 263 effect in combat. And Ranger still hit me in ranged (not in the last round, but in all rounds) so... I think your calculations are off. :P

He'll always get his Dex hits in...