Building my evasion to 175, worth it? (in General)

AdminShade December 3 2009 7:16 AM EST

Total Evasion 158

To get to a total evasion of 175, I'd need another 9.3 mil experience.
Would it be worth spending this experience into evasion or not?

QBJohnnywas December 3 2009 7:25 AM EST

XP spend aside, look at the weapons on the most valuable items page.

First thing to consider is: are there any there with PTH between 158 and 175? If there are, are they people you can't beat currently? Are they farming you? If yes then you might put a stop to that by upping your evasion.

Second thing to consider: are there people farming you with bigger PTH than 175? Whilst you won't evade those completely you will reduce their hit count, possibly significantly, perhaps even to the point of winning.

Third thing to consider: Is there anything else that would benefit from that XP spend? Perhaps to greater effect than the evasion?

miteke [Superheros] December 3 2009 7:26 AM EST

If you are aiming for archers it makes a lot of sense. If you do pump evasion, make sure the minion has extra hit points or armor and is up front.

If you find most of your fight list is non-archers, don't bother.

AdminShade December 3 2009 8:11 AM EST

1st thing to consider: there are some, and some of them are farming me indeed.
2nd thing to consider: yes there are, quite a number even.

3rd thing to consider:
I could put the experience into HP, but that would only make me live longer while their damage output won't be stopped.
I could put the experience into Dispel Magic, but I'm pumping all the experience I gather into the DM of my other minion.

So when I consider all 3 things: I guess it will be worth going from 158 to 175 and even to 200.

info for miteke:
Position is 1st
Armor: 116
High King of the Noldor cast Ablative Shield on all friendly Minions (6697044)
I might be able to pump a little bit more AC but not too much. Money is my enemy right now ;)

miteke [Superheros] December 3 2009 12:09 PM EST

That seems like a reasonable AS. I'm sure there are some that cast large enough DM to beat that down, but on the whole I think the minion should survive a couple of rounds - enough to make the Evasion worth it. The point is that if the minion is already getting wiped out in one round, the extra evasion is probably not going to help much. But the longer he lasts already, the more effective the extra evasion is going to be.

QBRanger December 3 2009 2:34 PM EST

With the penalty to your evasion from a base dex, would that xp into dexterity do you better?

Slight decrease in dex BTH perhaps vs those tanks with less than 2-3M dex and your evasion effect may increase a few points due to the decreased penalty.

{WW]Nayab [Cult of the Valaraukar] December 3 2009 5:39 PM EST

I agree with Ranger, by upping your dex not only are you decreasing the Dex ratio against smaller tanks reducing their hit chance but you are also gaining evasion due to a reduced penalty from the dex-evasion ratio.

kevlar December 3 2009 5:53 PM EST

Shade... when I had 50mil of exp trained into Evasion and then I trained DX to avoid the penalty, I only lost like 16 or so levels.. and I had the DX. I definitely preferred training the DX with it.
(I'm not a big fan of the high DX penalty)

AdminShade December 3 2009 6:08 PM EST

I've had a long discussion about this with Nemerizt and this is what both of us at the end agreed upon:

Training Evasion (only) will make it work at 60% efficiency.
Training Dexterity in addition will only make the experience used for DX work at 40% efficiency.
Therefore, experience wise, to gain the highest amount of Evasion, and thus highest amount of PTH removal, training just Evasion is most efficient.

Yes I do agree, also training DX will at some point remove BTH but, since I would need an incredible amount to be able to to so, this is undesired for my strategy.

QBRanger December 3 2009 6:21 PM EST


There is some flawed logic at play here.

Yes, it is more effective to lower PTH only with more evasion. Certainly.

However, as PTH is not the only factor in play vs tanks, dexterity and evasion combined is likely the best approach for an anti-tank minion.

To get 17 more minus PTH is 9.3M xp and I assume that is taking into account the minus from non-dex matched evasion.

With 800k dexterity you can lower the BTH but as much as 40-50 vs tanks with 2-3M dex.

Vs ToA tanks, I would think you would not lower their BTH much if any.

A lot depends on who you fight and how much dexterity they have.

Also, with 800k more dex, your evasion will go up a bit due to dexterity matching at least that 800k. You may get a couple more points of evasion in that respect.

AdminShade December 3 2009 6:59 PM EST

True, with 800k more DX, my evasion would certainly go up a few points.
True, I'd reduce the BTH of some tanks with some nice percentage

But what amount of hits does this represent? BTH can only grant double hits correct?
Then I should find out which amount of hits the people currently beating me gain from me having just my evasion?

AdminShade December 4 2009 7:01 AM EST

Another thing I am thinking of is EC / Axbow, there is no counter for it and people whom I fight and whom fight me use it. Therefore I'd like to not train DX to not waste the exp against them.

Cube December 4 2009 12:06 PM EST

The dex is truely worth it. A small amount of dex can dig a big chunk out of bth, that and you are getting the 40% for free basically. You probably sacrifice about 5 evasion for a massive change in bth. I did the math a few times before, if you even only chip at bth a tiny tiny bit, it'd be worth it.
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