Rares in auctions (in Changelog)

AdminJonathan May 19 2005 11:28 AM EDT

Not really a changelog entry, but News will be crowded for a couple days, so...

In keeping with his role as the Federal Reserve of Carnage Blender, Central Bank has placed a number of rares into auctions to increase supply where it was needed.

Central Bank considers the CB economy to be in excellent shape. Don't panic. :)

Update: split the ending times into two groups -- EB and CH at the original time, and the rest two days later

Quark May 19 2005 11:30 AM EDT


Arorrr May 19 2005 11:30 AM EDT


Quark May 19 2005 11:30 AM EDT

But seriously - very very good. Define a proper market value for the stuff that's ultra-high demand and doesn't have good meta-stats value.

Vagabond May 19 2005 11:31 AM EDT

Let the bidding frenzy begin

Arorrr May 19 2005 11:34 AM EDT

I say Jon the Allen Greenspan is hurting the economy!!!!!

*chant* free market ! free market ! free market !

what the heck, why not more:

*chant* World Peace ! World Peace ! Down with Carnage Blender !

*throwing rotten tomatoes*


LumpBot May 19 2005 11:34 AM EDT

Very nice =D Now I just need to figure out a get rich quick scheme to pick one up.

Arorrr May 19 2005 11:35 AM EDT

Spaceman, don't be like the last guy who sits on 6 based CBF tat...

Isn't that just suck?

Duke May 19 2005 11:38 AM EDT

That change is hard for those that just buy a ELB or DB the price will drop.I can understand that you want to absord the cash give from the CoBF remove but those change the face of the economy fast and it take to get stable,

AdminJonathan May 19 2005 11:38 AM EDT


given the presence of the tattoo artist it's hard to corner the TBF market :)

LumpBot May 19 2005 11:38 AM EDT

My get rich quick scheme will most likely consist of robbing a bank and using the USD to buy an ELB =P

QBJohnnywas May 19 2005 12:08 PM EDT

With the pr/nw link these are probably worth a lot more than upgraded versions. Lower pr players will be able to use them without affecting their game.

Now can anyone loan me 10 million?

Lol =)

LumpBot May 19 2005 12:11 PM EDT

I'll buy that 10 million from you after I rob my bank.

Arorrr May 19 2005 1:10 PM EDT

Report Spaceman to FBI... expect they storm into your room any minutes now.... muhahahhaha

Nixon Jibfest May 19 2005 1:28 PM EDT

By my estimate, Central Bank will still be in the red by about 100-120M. We need to pass a balanced budget amendment.

Max May 19 2005 1:45 PM EDT

Institute a Tea Tax

[-war-] May 19 2005 1:51 PM EDT

No Tea Tax, otherwise we will have a bloodless conflict of throwing it back into the water.

Mags May 19 2005 1:57 PM EDT

I agree with Mr. Nixon. There's almost not enough money in the entire CB2 economy to cover fiscal profligacy on this scale. Selling more bonds -- or "rare items" as you call them -- will only serve to further increase demand for money. We need a new chairman.

Nixon Jibfest May 19 2005 2:01 PM EDT

Mags, i think there's plenty of money out there and it's a good thing for the central bank to take some money out of circulation.

Vagabond May 19 2005 2:05 PM EDT

217,516 battles served in the past 24h

Let's say average rewards are around 100 cbd per fight, that's 20 million generated a day minimum.

Mags May 19 2005 2:13 PM EDT

I'm completely kidding. I'd agree that it's a good thing, especially with the drop in players recently.

That said, the cover-up has already begun. Profligacy isn't even in the spell-checker anymore.

[From CB1]Tequito May 19 2005 9:43 PM EDT

the way I see it, base items are more useful than money, so he's doing a great thing, cause if you spend money on upping what you have you're screwed.

/innocent smile.

webjunkie May 19 2005 10:19 PM EDT

if you are referring to me as the guy sitting on 6 ToBF's please get you facts in order, I am not sitting on them they are being sold they where offered in fs/wtb and there was not response so I have begun putting them in auctions. I do not sit on stuff I get and sell it

Arorrr May 19 2005 10:38 PM EDT

That's what I mean..

Someone is trying to corner a market, in this case TBF. It's backfired. Same with Jon's last ToE auctions.

Chargerz-Back May 19 2005 10:56 PM EDT

4 of the items thrown into auctions.... Adam, DBs, ELB, ELS. i own one of each. It is a conspiracy against me!

/me gets stormed by masked men and taken to a hidden location in New Mexico.

webjunkie May 20 2005 5:48 AM EDT

how has is back fired? I bought them at a low price and the ones I have sol I have made a small profit on. I am an arms dealer and that is why I bought them to make a profit. i am not sitting on them as you claimed they will all be sold and I expect the I will make a bit of profit on the deal when it is done.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 7:20 AM EDT

Well let me know when your done screwing with the economy. As a camper I have been hosed by almost every change made in the past couple months. The tattoo artist alone cost me at least 5 mil. I dont expect every change to be in my favor but why do campers get the short end of the stick every time? Thought you didnt have anything against campers. You know, all the stuff about merchant class and free market economy.

Next time you think more good rares need to be added to the economy why dont you have them spawn in the store? Isnt that the way the game was designed? I realy dont have a big problem with putting some good items into auction. Especialy after a item was removed like CoBF. But putting a pile of some of the most valued items into auction all at once is killing the secondary market.

This game has a appeal somewhat like Magic the Gathering in that items have real value in the secondary market. If you kill the secondary market you will lose some the that appeal. Im not just talking about campers here. People enjoy having items that are worth xx$ even if they never sell them. Think of the people who spent a lot of real life cash buying high valued items, hopefully from me. ;) Now how do you think they feel about this? Id be willing to bet they arnt all excited cause they can get another one at a reduced price now.

There has been a large drop in interest in this game lately. You might wonder why. I dont.

WeaponX May 20 2005 7:36 AM EDT

calm down man you sound like a whiner. i camp to but 5 more Elbs are not hurting the market. A because not eveyone who wants 1 has 5 mill on hand. B because out of the 30-40 in game there are hundreds of people playing and more to come. personally i think it will be good as prices will drop a little making more people able to buy an item which will ultimately drive prices back up.

webjunkie May 20 2005 7:58 AM EDT

Hivemind i see you point about "government interference" what is good for most governments is not good for small business. I am also a camper and have noticed the value of many items has dropped. How ever successful businesses in order to survive you may have to adapt new strategies. There are many tactics campers can use to swing the market back in there favor

AdminG Beee May 20 2005 8:11 AM EDT

Last time I looked this wasn't Camper Blender...

As Jon said... Central Bank considers the CB economy to be in excellent shape. Don't panic. :)

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 8:22 AM EDT

If I was a "whiner" I would have spoken up long before now. There has been a steady trend downward for the secondary market for quite some time. Mostly caused by the changes made. You think this isnt hurting the secondary market? You need a lesson in economics my friend. This wont just lower the value of the items in auction but lower the value of all items. In additon people will be afraid to spend a lot on a item cause they dont want to buy it and have 10 of them suddenly appear in auction all at once.

If this trend continues my change in strategy will be to find another game to play. Just like the 15 or so people in my clan did. Of which I was the only camper. Think Im the only one still playing and not nearly as much as I was before. I like the game (and not just the camping part) but the things that keep me from getting burned out on it are staring to dissapear.

TrueDevil [AAA] May 20 2005 8:28 AM EDT

well, Campers aren't really the most favourite people in CB 2 last time I checked, only Jon liked them. Maybe he thinks it's time to "change" campers ? I mean everybody get their share of "changes". (well, except for forgers, which already been done in CB 1)

webjunkie May 20 2005 8:36 AM EDT

G Beee, 8:11 AM EDT
Last time I looked this wasn't Camper Blender...

As Jon said... Central Bank considers the CB economy to be in excellent shape. Don't panic. :)

lol all tyrants say everything is good...and if the offer a vote for leadership they get a 100% turnout and everyone votes for them :P...if the economy was good then why is he fixing it...oh never mind maybe he never heard " if it aint broke don’t fiddle with it" (g rated version)

QBJohnnywas May 20 2005 8:37 AM EDT

A lot of the recent changes seem designed to do two things:

To make players think in the longer term about their game - so no high NW until their char really needs it for instance. This encourages people to invest time in CB which is a good thing in the longer term. If you want a quick fix game then CB probably isn't for you anymore

To discourage the presence of USD in the game. If ploughing lots of cash, (which you have to buy with USD because there's no way you could make that cash in game quickly) into items is going to bring you penalties you're not going to do it very often. If this lowers the price of rares then that's better for those players who are playing the game by the book and would never be able to afford huge rares otherwise isn't it?

I camped for a while in CB1. For me it was the easiest way of making some cash to get my character started. So I've nothing against camping. What I don't like is those people who make a RL living out of a game. The USD sales have changed the nature of the game. Jon's recent changes were only a reaction to what was going on.

And if 5 more rares in the auctions is affecting your business you can't be running it very well. There are 5000 players in CB, plenty of market opportunities for the savvy camper.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 9:25 AM EDT

I just camped a Morgal-Hammer. So it wouldnt be a bad idea to put it in auction right now? I mean there are 5000 players after all, right? I think not.

Why would Jonathan be trying to kill the USD in the secondary market? That would just be stupid. USD being spent in the game is good for him not bad. It means there is a high interest in the game. People having a high interest in the game and spending USD on it is how HE makes his money. By supportership and selling supporter items. If he lowers the USD aspect of the secondary market he will only be hurting himself.

I am probibly the closest to somebody making a living of this game. I camp items, sell them in auction and then sell the cash for USD. I dont see how this would be hurting the game for casual players. I make about 100-200 USD a month on it. If you think thats a living then you must have a internet connection in your grass hut. All that does for me is give me a little extra spending cash.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 9:28 AM EDT

And by the way, its not 5 items its 24 of the better items in the game.

QBJohnnywas May 20 2005 9:33 AM EDT

How are lower prices going to affect your camping? If prices are lower you potentially have more customers not less. I don't see 24 (I was just counting the ELBs) extra rares entering the game lowering prices. Even if people manage to buy them cheap from the auctions the likelihood is that if and when they come to sell them on they will sell them at a much higher rate. There will always be demand for the 'rare' items.

The only thing it hurts is your USD sales right? And 200 dollars a month might not be a 'living' but it's a bit more than pocket money for a lot of people....

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 9:56 AM EDT

"How are lower prices going to affect your camping? If prices are lower you potentially have more customers not less."

How are lower prices going to hurt my sales from camping? Hmm....maybe cause the items I get sell for less. There are a limited number of items I can camp from the store so there is no way to increase volume. Having more customers that are only willing to pay less does nothing to help me or the economy as a whole.

You only see Jon selling 5 items? I see....
5 Cornuthaum
5 Displacement Boots
5 Adamantite Cuirass
5 Elven Long Bow
4 Elven Long Sword

QBJohnnywas May 20 2005 10:05 AM EDT

with regard to lowering prices - a bid of 4 mill on one of those ELBs is market rate isn't it for a base ELB? So people are still prepared to pay for items. And an extra 5 ELB's, (or Corns or DB's or..) in the rares market, when there are 5000+ players won't affect your game much at all. Like I said, if it does then you're not running your business very well...

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 10:57 AM EDT

Those items will prob sell for over current market value because of all the cash generated by the items that where removed. Thats why Jon put those items up for sale. He wanted a cash sink because a lot of cash was added to the economy reciently. My problem isnt that he made a cash sink buy how he did it. There are ways of doing the same thing that doesnt drop the value of items. Its the long term effect of of doing things like this that I am concerned about.

There are 5000+ accounts. There arnt 5000+ players. Of those who have accounts and do actualy play generally only the players with higher PR char are my customers. And those players are dropping like flies.

Then again maybe your right. The economy isnt going to pot, Im just a bad businessman. Im always making bad descisions. Like not selling out all of my tats before Jon makes them all worth 200k + the base value of the least valuable tat. Even though some where selling for over 3 mil before the change. Yea thats the problem, Im just stupid. So Ill shut up now.

Gold Piece May 20 2005 11:00 AM EDT

Games are made to have fun, not make business off it or treat it as stock shares.I think this is basically to clean up and attempt to flush out campers.We don't need to look at CB2 as an economy or a money flow, we need to look at it for what it really is, just a game.

QBJohnnywas May 20 2005 11:05 AM EDT

Hive, just voicing my opinion. I'm not necessarily right, just think I am (lol). If I don't agree with something I tend to speak up. Nothing personal! As Emerald says, it's a game after all =)

Special J May 20 2005 11:17 AM EDT

Personaly, this is what I am getting from your long drawn out posts;

-It is not fair that I can not make real money from selling fake merchandise, how dare you take away my ability to gouge the market and take advantage of people willing to spend real money on a game.-

Personaly, I hope you lose every customer you ever had, due to your stance that You making money is some sort of right you have been given. How thin is the air up there? You know, on the back of that tall horse.

This is a game, a game provided free to you, how dare you get upset when the person who provides the game free of charge, changes something so you can no longer make the money you did in the past.

For shame.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 11:47 AM EDT

A quote from FAQ about camping...

"Rewarding players who put more effort into this part of the game enhances the economical metagame. For some reason nobody complains that Joe Newbie can't beat the #1 guy who has worked his butt off to get there, but anyone with half a brain (maybe that's the problem) seems to think it grossly unfair that people who spend more time in the stores get more good items. Other games like to have explicit "merchant classes;" CB achieves the same effect without the extra complexity simply by allowing you to choose where to spend your BA -- fighting, forging, or in the stores. Note that it's a self-balancing system: if it's too easy to make large amounts cash camping, more people will do it, making it harder to earn as much money."

I dont recall complaining that the USD value has declined. Or saying that I have a right to make USD off this game. In fact I wasnt the one who brought up USD in the first place. I make CB2$ off of camping. What I choose to do with the CB2$ after I get it is up to me. In my case I choose to sell it for USD. Instead I could have the highest NW char in the game. Or I could start a savings and loan like some players have. Maybe having a x200 dagger would be cool.

I did complain about the decline in market value of items caused directly by Jon's changes and in this case his auction.

If this game is free can I have my 10$ supportership fee back?

moser May 20 2005 11:50 AM EDT

So you donate money and then want it back? If you quit for good I'll paypal you $10.

Special J May 20 2005 11:57 AM EDT

If you quit, and the admins block your IP block forever, I will send your $10 DONATION back to you.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:01 PM EDT

After going back to my original post I see that I did mention the USD aspect of the secondary market. Opps. In any case what I said there is true.

All I asked for was that he let us know when he is done "fixing" the economy and that future changes not affect it so much. If this translates to "Im no making enough USD off this game...waaaa" then maybe you should get your translator fixed. I play this game for fun. I make a little cash sure but I wouldnt do it if it wasnt like a compeditive slot machine to me. I play poker for fun too. Am I evil because I make a little cash playing that game too?

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:01 PM EDT

I can totally see what Hivemind is saying and agree with him to a certain extent. I definitely don't agree with how he presented his argument though. Chances are, if anybody reads this thread, they'd probably think twice about doing business with Hive in the future. Hive is absolutely correct that the changes in CB2 have been bad for campers. What his egotistical (i use that word for its actual definition, not as a derogatory) point of view overlooked is that those who having been fighting for 3 months and setting up their strategies have been affected 10-20x worse than campers. Campers walked away from the changes *relatively* unharmed.

Hive, the $10 is for supportership. You can play the game without paying it. People voluntarily pay the $10 to "support" CB. It's not so CB can support the players.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:07 PM EDT

If the only way I can get my money back is to quit than it isn't realy free is it?

Look waaaay above your heads. If you try really hard you might see my point up there somewhere. ;)

mihalis May 20 2005 12:10 PM EDT

Hive, a quote from yourself: "Those items will prob sell for over current market value because of all the cash generated by the items that where removed." So what is the problem then? Cash that came from central bank or whoever pays for deleted items will return to central bank through auctions. If the 24 rares would have been put in the game through the store, that would have been no money sink at all, since the cash would be in the hands of the campers.
"All I asked for was that he let us know when he is done "fixing" the economy and that future changes not affect it so much."
Obviously, Jon will be done at the end of the month... until next change month! ;-)

LumpBot May 20 2005 12:12 PM EDT

Hivemind that sounds like, "After eating my fast food sandwich, I decided it wasn't all I hoped, I want my money back even though it is all ready consumed."

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:14 PM EDT

I made no comment about how other have been affected by the changes. I am aware that some have been affected a lot. Im sure they spoke their piece about. Now I am speaking mine.

The only thing I seem to have overlooked is how much some people hate campers.

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:21 PM EDT

1. Jon takes out a lot of rares from the game and replaces it with CB2.
2. Jon put a lot of different rares BACK into the game and takes away CB2.
3. Stable economy.

Jon is correct.... and that's the first time I've ever posted a statement like that.

Re: Hivemind. If you guys can see past his "personal" objections to the change, his argument is sound. Seems like a contradiction but Jon and Hive are correct, in my opinion. Hive's argument is correct in the short run. Jon's actions are right for the long run... again, in my opinion.

Take it easy on Hive. He's actually an OK person.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:22 PM EDT

From Nixon Jibfest...

"Chances are, if anybody reads this thread, they'd probably think twice about doing business with Hive in the future."

I find that comment interesting considering you are also a camper and I represent direct competition for you. So you agree with my point but im still evil and should be run out of town? Lol. Nice try fluffy.

WeaponX May 20 2005 12:22 PM EDT

hivermind your whole complaint is "i make less cb2 for the purpose of selling it for usd" nobody will shed a tear for that

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:25 PM EDT

Hive. I don't consider you my competition. I don't consider any campers "my competition." I support every camper there is.... if you didn't notice, i even started an econ clan with campers!!!

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:25 PM EDT

Jon was right to make a cash sink. I disagree with how he made it.

"Everyone knows one horse is the fastest. The question is which one. Details are everything" - Robert A Heinline

mihalis May 20 2005 12:32 PM EDT

The say clearly and simply how you think that the cash sink should have been done... most readers won't read this through to find out.

Gold Piece May 20 2005 12:33 PM EDT

Eh, people could just go on a strike and refuse to buy from campers if this is going to be turned into some kinda of stock exhange or investment.I mean I have no problem with someone selling for usd, but what I do have a problem with is when someone sells it for as an extra income.It's a game, we are suppose to have fun or otherwise waste time, not create stress.

Ok Players play the game of course.On the other hand Campers, they don't really play the game therefor they don't have much reason to be here.They just sit in the shop using their BA looking for rare items for cheap, then just to sale it to players for a much higher price and then sometimes trade the cb2 they got for usd.They just create stress and take fun outta the game.You could refer campers as "leeches" or "parasites", because they basically feed off of the game.

I really don't care what responses I will get from this post, I just want you to remember this...

Don't think of CB2 as a profit, think of CB2 as a Game.

mchaos May 20 2005 12:36 PM EDT

Hive, two things:

1. It is ridiculous to want your $10 back. The game is free, your decision to "buy" supportership from Jon for $10 has nothing to do with this, you didn't "buy" anything beyond some supporter preferences, and Jon made no guarantees about the game. Indeed, the support perks are far less helpful for campers than other players, so you can't even argue that you were 'effectively' required to become a supporter to be competitive. As another player who has made significant USD off the game, I think it's a pretty jerk move to complain about giving Jon $10.

2. As a matter of opinion (not fact) I think that overall campers will benefit from this month's changes. Linking NW to PR means that you can't just dump a bunch of $CB2 into a compound or katana and be competitive with ELB and ELS users and should drive rare prices up. But this is just my opinion, we'll have to see how things play out.

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:38 PM EDT

Re: USD sales. USD has it's place in CB. I've never done it before my charity drive but that was simply my choice. As a result, I either ended up with a stupid amount of CB2 or sat on a lot of rares that others could use. That's worse for the economy than selling for USD. Campers contribute to the economy and the community in their own way.

re: campers being leaches... I can name a lot more players who manipulate the USD market moreso than campers.

Manta May 20 2005 12:39 PM EDT

Hivemind if your current way of playing is not working anymore for you, you will have to change it.
Everybody else had to do it, often more than once, why not you?

If you thought that the same strategy could work for ever here, well, you were wrong.

Special J May 20 2005 12:39 PM EDT

Nixon's point was not to run you off as competition, Nixon has no issue selling anything, or getting forge jobs for the rest of his clan. Just because it is an answer you do not like does not mean it is meant to be harmful to your reputation.

LumpBot May 20 2005 12:39 PM EDT

Emerald, that may be one of the most ignorant posts ever. I'm never mean to anyone, but who are you to say what is "fun" and what isn't? I loved the feeling when I bought an ELB in CB1 and a Morg from the store. It was probally my happiest and most fun moment in CB history.
Some people don't find forging fun at all, but I love it. I really don't enjoy fighting in this game that much.
You are not the one who can go around and say campers are parasites because they have their fun picking up rares in minutes while you fight for months to afford it.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:40 PM EDT

So if I didnt make USD on it then would my point be valid? If I did something else with the cash instead of selling it would that change anything about what I said?

That seems to be the real issue here. Its not that Im wrong. Its that you people object to anyone selling something in a game for cash. Weather or not this is a good or bad thing is not the issue I posted about. What I will say about it is this. If Jon doesnt want people selling things in his game for USD then why does he allow people to do so in the forums. Even so far as to make a forum especialy for doing it. If you dont like they idea then here is my advice....dont sell anything and dont buy anything. If you dont like whats on the radio change the station. There problem solved.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:43 PM EDT

"I have no problem with someone selling for usd, but what I do have a problem with is when someone sells it for as an extra income." -Emerald

Im sorry but thats just funny.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:45 PM EDT

And for the record I dont want my 10$ back. Someone was saying something about the game being free. Was just trying to make a point.

Maybe next time I should use smaller words.

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:46 PM EDT

hive.... emerald's statement is pretty funny. missed that contradiction on the first read.

LumpBot May 20 2005 12:46 PM EDT

The game is free Hivemind, you chose to pay that money, it wasn't demanded.

Special J May 20 2005 12:47 PM EDT

I do not have a problem with people selling items for USD, I have a problem with people complaining because they are not going to make as much USD off the game.

And that Sir is EXACTLY what you are doing when the sugar coated crap boils away.

I must have missed the sign out front that said "sign up for CB and make $200 a month in REAL HARD CASH!"

You said you wanted your $10 "fee" back, I belive from the way you have spoken, you made that back long ago.

Quit whining and find a more valid arguement and sturdier soap box to shout from.

LumpBot May 20 2005 12:48 PM EDT

Hivemind, you are just swinging blind. Everyone has had to change their strat this month. Everyone changed, but you seem to be the only one complaining about it. Even when Nixon stood up on your side, you lashed out at him. Not a good idea to fight your comrades ;)

LumpBot May 20 2005 12:50 PM EDT

*claps for mr wuss*

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:52 PM EDT

"So if I didnt make USD on it then would my point be valid?" --Hivemind

Your point about the economy is somewhat valid but, unfortunately, it was overshadowed by how you brought up your personal stake in USD. Now this entire discussion is about USD sales. It's a shame because you did bring up some interesting arguments about the economy... unfortunately, i don't think anyone knows what they are anymore.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 12:56 PM EDT

If you all knew how hard I have been laughing during this whole thing I think you would all turn blue.

I think I will change my strat from buy from store and sell in auction to enraging the whole comunity. This is much more fun.

Nixon Jibfest May 20 2005 12:58 PM EDT

wow... sounds like we've all been officially trolled by Hivemind.

mchaos May 20 2005 12:59 PM EDT


The fact that you sell for USD is revelevent to your (apparently rhetorical) request for the $10 back in that CB has provided you (and me) with an opportunity to make a substantial amount of USD. If you were 12 and had saved up your allowance for a month to buy supportership it wouldn't make you any less wrong about what supportership is, but it would make you less of a jerk.

If you want to debate the effect of Jonathan's sales on the market for those items, I get that. If you want to complain about how this kills your strategy, I think you're wrong, but I get that too. What none of us get is your bizzare complaint about how you've been cheated out of $10 because Jonathan has changed the game since you became a supporter.

Manta May 20 2005 12:59 PM EDT

Behold! A troll is born.
Unfortunately, trolls are short-lived here. Try some religious forum, instead...

Maelstrom May 20 2005 1:02 PM EDT

There are a few points that have been raised here, but not really addressed. Everyone concentrating on putting down Hivemind, and not answering his concerns, so:
  1. Jon did not associate NW with PR to decrease the value of items (and in turn the selling of times), but to make a character's power more transparent, and to encourage long-term investment in the game.
  2. The market value of items has gone down not because Jon has added or removed items, but because players now need MPR more than NW. Buying items essentially harms players, so players don't want to buy more. The reduced market value of items is a side-effect of Jon's changes, not his goal.
  3. Jon did not add rare items to the auctions to decrease the market value of items of those types, but "to increase supply where it was needed." I know the basics of economics, but I highly doubt that any of those will sell for less than market value.
  4. Jon did not make any changes simply to decrease the profits of campers, but rather to make the game more enjoyable for all players.
Hivemind, this last bit is why people are arguing with you. You took these changes in the game to be a personal loss, ignoring the fact that the majority of the players benefit. Most people don't care at all whether you make money or not.

Jason Bourne May 20 2005 1:12 PM EDT

bah...just paid a mill for an adam...now 4 are in auctions for 140k...

oops :P

smallpau1 - Go Blues [Lower My Fees] May 20 2005 1:15 PM EDT

yea with 3 days remaining, their not gonna stay at 140k...

sssimmo May 20 2005 1:28 PM EDT

This post has turned into the most selfish bunch of balony! 90% of players would be happy with these auctions. This economy is not here to satisfy the "wants" of the minorities! Get over it!

[EG] Almuric May 20 2005 1:31 PM EDT

Why are people still arguing with Hivemind? He's already admitted he's trolling.

Anyone who thinks the 25-30 items Jon put in auctions will affect prices for those items is ignorant if they're new or a moron if you've been here for a while. Either that or you haven't thought it through. (I'm trying to be kind. Work with me.)

Let's take Corns as an example. I see 5 in auctions. Just about every character (except solo tanks) can use a corn. Just about anyone would love to have one and as such, 5 more is a drop in the bucket. I doubt the average price for a corn will drop even $100K.

Same with DB's.

Same with Elbows. Why, they're the best ranged weapon, by far. Only one with a base of 6. The curve is much shallower. With net worth tied to PR, anyone who has a $10 mil compound is touched in the head. There is absolutely no reason to up your compound that much - it's not good enough and adds too much to your PR. Spend $5 mil on the Elbow and up it to $5 mil NW and you've got a much better weapon that will give you better fight rewards.

ELS is the only thing in auction whose net worth has dropped hugely. And that's not because Jon put 5 in auctions. It's because of the Vorpal Blade. The VB is as good, if not better, than the ELS. The ELS will probably never regain its former glory. Not for at least a few months after the VB is no longer the supporter item.

Just like those of us who fight aren't guaranteed anything about how much reward we get or how well we do, campers aren't guaranteed returns on their purchases. If you fight enough, you'll gain PR. If you camp enough, you'll get some rare items that will be worth more than you paid for it. How much more is indeterminate. If you can't handle that... quit.

Everyone, let's please stop feeding the trolls. They're annoying enough without being well-fed. Thanks.

Hivemind [The Hive] May 20 2005 2:33 PM EDT

Its amasing how every single thing I said that was ment litteraly everyone read a bunch of stuf into it that I never ment to say and everything I said in jest was taken litteraly. I think this is the best evidance so far that aliens realy did build the pyramids. I dont think the human race is that capable. I do think this whole thing is funny but wasnt trolling.

My original point was that to use auctioning high valued items as a cash sink hurts the economy by reducing the value of items. If you dont think it does talk to someone who keeps close tabs on the economy. This makes a lot of people upset. Those that have paid dearly for good items and those who intend to sell those items in the future (not to mention those who will get whacked by those items). This in turn will hurt the secondary market that creates interest in the game. Less interest in the game is bad for Jon who generates revinue from it. It is also bad for those who play for the economic part of the game. Of which I am one of many. There will always be those who think that everyone should be able to easily get the best of everything failing to realise that wouldnt be fun for anybody. Aside from it being a effective cash sink the ONLY people who will beinfit from this are the 24 people who end up with those items. So dont talk to me about the minority of those who play the economic side.

My real concern that I didnt mention is that more of this kind of thing will cause people to leave the game. Like the 15 odd members of my allied group of clans have. That will hurt the economy more than anything. I have worked hard to become a good camper and it pains me to see that effort going to waste if the economy dies. Weather that benifit is through enjoyment of of the game or some extra spending cash does not matter. At least to me. It seems to matter a whole bunch to some other people, though Im not sure why.

I think all you anti-camper types would be suprised at how many PM's I have gotten from people who agree but are afraid of getting flamed like I have. Thats ok, Ill take the heat for them. In the Hive language there is no word for fear.

AdminShade May 20 2005 2:48 PM EDT

Hivemind instead of trolling and repeating yourself over and over about how awful this all would be.

look back on when Jonathan auctioned off the initial batches of Helms of Ecthelion...

did their value go down with the second batch, effectively doubling their presence in CB, no it didnt.

did the third batch of them lower their price? hardly to none existing.

instead of thinking about your possible negative thing happening to you because 24 more items get into the game think about the hundreds of people that will begin and continue playing more and fight more making more items spawn in the game.

yes the store restocks based on the amount of fighting that is going on in this game, not by how empty it is.

also those 24 items will only make other people a little envious (even if it would be only very little) and those people who either miss the last bid or just don't have money for it yet will just go to you and your forum sale / auction when you just camped such an item, and they will be paying pretty much the same as for those that were just 'made' into the game if not more.

so either stop trolling around and badmouth every aspect of Jonathans way to make the community want more items, and thus making a small cash drain, but in the end making them once want those items for themselves and make them go to campers later on in the game, for the same amount or similar (think about inflation) amount of money.

AdminJonathan May 20 2005 3:07 PM EDT

forum banned hivemind

we tolerate neither trolling nor willful stupidity here.

Devil Burrito May 20 2005 3:14 PM EDT

"... willful stupidity here."


Arorrr May 20 2005 4:11 PM EDT

I was about to say something about banning the troll. I guess Jon sword play is faster than me. Troll = evil creature of LOTR; hence it should be deal here the same way...


deathwake May 20 2005 4:20 PM EDT

Guess he will really be mad, it's going to be hard for him to sell his stuff for USD now that he can't post.

Undertow May 20 2005 4:21 PM EDT

Yah, but everyone knows the trolls regenerate. I mean, even if you split one in half you just get two new trolls. You know what the only thing to stop trollish regeneration is???


Manta May 20 2005 4:57 PM EDT

"Unfortunately, trolls are short-lived here."
Told you.

CoolWater May 22 2005 8:33 AM EDT

BTW, I wonder if there will be a 2nd batch of these items. I won't be surprise.

[Banned]Monty May 22 2005 11:40 AM EDT

that'd be great :)

{EQ}Viperboy May 22 2005 7:41 PM EDT

additions to auctions of rares may not lower prices but it sure does keep them from rising as well as keep the price satibilized. For example if the rat at which they spawn si too low and demand is greater, all the rich people will bid more and more insane bids, for a particular item. Thus causing the prices to stay the same and meet some of the demand to keep prices stable.

Hence to all who disagree with Jon, I disagree with you, Jon and the central Bank is doing the right thing.

Jason Bourne May 22 2005 7:51 PM EDT

no one is disagreeing with you viper, ur right, if jon keeps adding items with the rise in demand for them, then the price for one will remain stagnant...its just for those that have one of those rares in auctions that were banking on an increase in rarity, which has now been postponed for a long while...

AdminJonathan May 22 2005 9:32 PM EDT

There will be no more auctions of rares until July at the earliest.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] May 24 2005 2:15 AM EDT

Is it me or has the auction time for the DBs, ELS s and Adams increased by 2 days? Didn't they go in at the same time as the ELBows and Corns?

I was sure the Adams were finishing today...

But it's early!

sssimmo May 24 2005 2:25 AM EDT

yeah i thought that was strange too.

Vagabond May 24 2005 2:33 AM EDT

Checkout the update to the first post.

QBJohnnywas May 24 2005 2:35 AM EDT

Gives them more time to hit appropriate prices

Arorrr May 24 2005 1:01 PM EDT

I'm telling you, Jon will do anything to get Central Bank back to black.

This thread is closed to new posts. However, you are welcome to reference it from a new thread; link this with the html <a href="/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001Lto">Rares in auctions</a>