Change needed... (in General)


Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] February 12 2010 8:03 AM EST

It kind of sucks I can't hit all of my BA for my ncb.. Why? Is it because I'm not committed? No it's because I have a life that I need to pay for, I work eight hours per day. Which right now is about 60-80 BA missed everyday!.. And icing on the cake is I can't even use the get more BA button, because it costs to fricken much...

TheHatchetman February 12 2010 8:56 AM EST

Ain't we just have one of these threads? One where every argument from "It'll help player retention" to "I should be able to use all of my BA logging in once or twice a day" all the way to "It's fine as it is. Everyone misses a little, if you miss more than them you deserve to fall behind", with special guest appearance by the ever-popular "Raar! I'm gonna beat you up cuz you're not typing what i want to read"...

By "just have one of these threads", I mean it's still open to replies. By "we" I mean even you replied to it ~_^

Lord Bob February 12 2010 10:11 AM EST

It kind of sucks I can't hit all of my BA for my ncb.

No it doesn't.

I work eight hours per day.

So do I. I get as much BA in as you.

Which right now is about 60-80 BA missed everyday!

The idea of BA is that you WILL miss some of it. This is a good thing.

And 60-80 is what I usually miss every day as well. Nobody can get them all, and that's the way it is supposed to be.

And icing on the cake is I can't even use the get more BA button, because it costs to fricken much.

That's the drawback to the NCB, one I'm very grateful is in place.

AdminShade February 12 2010 10:12 AM EST

Nobody can get them all,

Oh yes some people can

Lord Bob February 12 2010 10:22 AM EST

Oh yes some people can

Ok, very few can. And they deserve to beat Kefeck and myself.

AdminShade February 12 2010 10:24 AM EST

Indeed, they deserve that. I however find it sad that someone complains so much in this way about the NCB. If you don't like it, then just don't use it...

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] February 12 2010 10:24 AM EST

Unless their strat sucks royally.

In which case they don't deserve to beat anyone, regardless of how much BA they spend! :P

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] February 12 2010 10:25 AM EST

however find it sad that someone complains so much in this way about the NCB. If you don't like it, then just don't use it...


Careful mate.

That's akin to saying "if you don't like it, go find another game..."

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] February 12 2010 10:29 AM EST

if you cannot hit all of your ba with an ncb, you would likely be better off buying a character outright.

AdminShade February 12 2010 10:50 AM EST

That's akin to saying "if you don't like it, go find another game..."


Perhaps a bit poorly worded, but I meant that you have a choice between starting a NCB and have 10/20 BA regeneration and the chance of missing BA or not start one and continue with your non NCB character.

Joel February 12 2010 11:27 AM EST

I say there should be a kind of balance, in this game, that is equivalent to the feature, in most games, that allows a player to play as often as he/she wants and still anticipate a time when he/she will finally be at the top. It will definitely come at a much later date than if one where to play 10 hours a day, but it is still achievable, and also still be progressing at the same rate as everyone else, when they play.
Am I describing something that the rolling bonus would do? I don't know, I haven't read that thread in a long time, but I think that everyone should be able to take a break or pay attention to a problem/disaster without having the extra problem of knowing that all the time spent, up until the interruption, is now all wasted and he/she might as well quit because the only chance to reach the top, without playing for 5 years, has vanished suddenly.
About the "entitlement" feeling: If most players feel that way, and we want to keep players, then shouldn't the game be made so that most players will find this game appealing? If most players want to be able to reach the top, then why don't we give them an actually reasonable chance to do it? Its not about the minority that thinks this game should be as hard as possible to reach the top, it is about the majority. I know this is "just a game" but the creator probably thinks about it more as a business. How do businesses make money? By supplying a service or a product that people want! Businesses are always upgrading and changing products according to the desire of the majority of the customers. Such an approach to this game would really bring it into the mainstream and Jon may even be able to use this game as his main money source! I'll bet he would like that!

VsCountStrum [Black Watch] February 12 2010 11:43 AM EST

Not everyone can reach the Top in this game. The problem with everyone reaching the Top in this game is that the Top is player determined. I play another game some Adventure Quest. There, the Top, is a level 130. When you reach that you have indeed reached the Top. It also allows for 100s or 1000s of people to reach the Top. In CB, however, there is no final or top level. If there are 100 active players striving to be at the Top, they can not all make it regardless of any reasonable the reward system.

There will always be players on the Net that are willing or able to what is necessary to maximize any game. I am not one of them. I work (though I can often play at work), I travel (both for pleasure and work), I have a RL, and I enjoy a full night sleep All of these things cause me to miss BA. That is just part to game.

I salute those who have put in the effort to be at the Top. Having been there before, I know what it takes.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] February 12 2010 11:51 AM EST

people want to reach the top because of the sense of accomplishment. if it was too easy the sense of accomplishment would be gone. players would no longer want to reach the top. i think this sums up many veterans thoughts on the issue.

they fear making it too easy would mean the death of the game. i do have some news for them though, the game seems to be dying regardless. it is a bit of a conundrum and anyone claiming to have an easy answer is likely delusional.

i tend to think that if it is made too easy, we ill get a mostly transient population and if made too hard we will have what is happening now with a loyal playerbase that is quite small and a very low retention rate of new users.

Sickone February 12 2010 11:58 AM EST

The problem is not "reaching the top".
Of course reaching the top can only be accomplished by very few, very dedicated people.

The problem is reaching a REASONABLE PERCENTAGE of the top's performance level... where "reasonable" would be anywhere from 60% to 75% of the top Max Tattoo Level (as opposed to MPR, since MPR is _not_ linear).
Far too few people, even people that _ARE_ reasonably dedicated get there, compared to what should get there, and one of the main culprits is "missing BA", especially early on.

Anything that requires logins that are more often than 10 hours at ANY level of the game just to have a CHANCE to pull it off is unreasonable.
Right now, that limit is a bit over 5 hours at the lowest MPR levels.
Which is totally unreasonable.

Demigod February 12 2010 12:08 PM EST

Am I describing something that the rolling bonus would do?



Not exactly. The RB would help those who have fallen behind, so it would benefit those who miss occasional BA but especially those who have disappeared for six months. The concept is that your N*C may start at an insane 400% bonus, but it will taper off to 0% as you get closer to the top.

For example, if you have a 5% bonus, then get thrown in prison for assaulting a fellow CBer, you might return in a month to find that you have a 10% bonus due to the top ranks moving further ahead.

Since the RB tapers off, you would still have no better chance of reaching the top ranks than you do today. However, the game would be more forgiving (read: enjoyable) to the casual players who just want to have fun in the middle ranks.

three4thsforsaken February 12 2010 12:13 PM EST

CB is special because there exist a chance to catch up or even make it in the top ten in an uncapped game.

The vast majority of uncapped games (no max level) makes little or no effort to allow new players a shot for the top in a fraction of the time. People still play those games, there is no injustice there.

Why should a game both aim to give new characters a chance for huge growth and make it easier? What makes us feel so entitled for so much? If we lower the bar where does it stop?

I think this is strange escalation of sorts. There is this idea that everyone is burning all their BA all the time, so the standard is raised. When burning all BA used to be the competitive standard, now burning all BA is becoming the casual standard? Now it's impossible to enjoy the game without burning all BA? Does anyone else find this strange?

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] February 12 2010 3:17 PM EST

CB should be strategy based to determine the top. Not who can log on the most..

AdminTitan [The Sky Forge] February 12 2010 3:23 PM EST

Yeah, let's get rid of the game part of CB! Just a quiz of unique strategies. Every two weeks we have a battle of ideas that only lasts one day, the best strategy at the end wins. You only have to log in twice a month, and every month there is a different person on top. If you have been on top in the last 10 years, you can't win, this way everyone can be on top once. This would be the greatest game ever!!!

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] February 12 2010 3:25 PM EST

Yeah, let's get rid of the game part of CB! Just a quiz of unique strategies. Every two weeks we have a battle of ideas that only lasts one day, the best strategy at the end wins. You only have to log in twice a month, and every month there is a different person on top. If you have been on top in the last 10 years, you can't win, this way everyone can be on top once. This would be the greatest game ever!!!


Taking it a bit drastic don't you think

;P

DoS [Demon Forging] February 12 2010 3:28 PM EST

Once you get to 6/20, it isn't even who can log on the most, so the near-top/top is strategy based. When you took on the NCB, you knew that you had to log on every so often to burn your BA or you would fall behind.

Hey, I even think that 7/20 sucks right now. It really does suck waking up at 4 am just so I can miss money time. At least at 6/20 I can sleep for 8 hours (or in your case work your 8 hour day and not miss any BA) and only have to wake up a little past 5:30, which is when I usually wake up on MW anyway.

I have multiple clan mates that are in the same boat and are even considering getting a phone with Internet capabilities just to spend their BA. Sure they complain, but they don't think that the system needs to change just because they miss some BA everyday.

WE ALL have days where we may miss a little BA here or there, or hardly ever. It would be naive to say that no one misses any of there BA all the time (CB goes down sometimes ;) ).

Wraithlin February 12 2010 3:30 PM EST

actually titan it would be better if we all logged in 10 times a day and we just all talked and chatting about who has been here the longest because that guy is first, and if you've been here second longest you're second.

Your team doesn't really matter at all, just how long you've been with the game. Hopefully some day through determination and dedication everyone ahead of you will quit and then you'll be first.

AdminTitan [The Sky Forge] February 12 2010 3:35 PM EST

^ That's what I'm hoping for!

Little Anthony February 12 2010 3:39 PM EST

I missed 2-3 days worth of BA and i ain't complaining lol

TheHatchetman February 12 2010 3:39 PM EST

Give an inch, and they'll want a yard. Give a yard, and they'll demand the whole damn field. Anybody remember 10 minute refreshes? 7/10 being the lowest regen? The deadzone? Top 10 score being the only ones exempt from negative challenge bonus?

Lochnivar has put his time, his effort, his thought, and the last remnants of his sanity into Anbhas for over 5 years now, and recently broke the 4m MPR mark. You want *everyone* to do that in 6 months with about a third of the time and effort spent on each individual day/week/month? o.O

Wraithlin February 12 2010 3:44 PM EST

You want *everyone* to do that in 6 months with about a third of the time and effort spent on each individual day/week/month? o.O


Yes actually.

4 mil MPR doesn't mean anything anymore, it's less than 80% of the top guy.

In another 5 years, 7 mil MPR won't mean anything it will be less than 80% of the top guy.

Welcome to the realization of a game with no cap.

Either it really is a game where nobody ever changes ranking because there is no catch-up system, or the amount of MPR you have matters less and less the longer the game is played.

Vicious Cat February 12 2010 5:28 PM EST

Actually, I don't think you should be forced to log in any more than the games creator, whose philosophy we all, obviously, agree with.
So, every few months then :-)

TheHatchetman February 13 2010 2:06 AM EST

Either it really is a game where nobody ever changes ranking because there is no catch-up system, or the amount of MPR you have matters less and less the longer the game is played.


We have a catch up system. That's what the N*B is. You have the option to catch up if you want to put some effort into it. If you can't/won't put in the effort, you won't get to where you think you deserve to be, nor should you. An addition to this system is challenge bonus. If your PR is lower than Anbhas's, and you beat the same char, you're getting more XP and money than he did for the same feat.

CB is 100% PvP, which means every step up towards "the top" is off of someone else's head. If you are unwilling, or unable to put even close to equivalent effort for less than 10% of the time, get used to smelling their stinkbait.

Shark February 13 2010 2:23 AM EST

not being able to log on and losing BA sucks yeah but
look at the bright side you do have a life :)
thems others dont :)

[RX3]Cotillion February 13 2010 3:17 AM EST

x/10

'nuff said.
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