Minion Count (in General)


AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] June 28 2011 10:39 AM EDT

9 out of the current Top 10 teams as of posting are 4 minions.

The only one that isn't is a three minion team in 7th place.

4 Minions FTW?

Don't we need some rebalancing here? Or does everyone think this is ok?

Zenai June 28 2011 11:14 AM EDT

Maybe, I think they just hired up to this point. A lot of the time this is the case. However taking a look at how the exp rewards are distributed may shine a light on the situation.

I am interested to know both so I would say ask how many started out with less than 4 minions and hired later in the game for the MPR bump.(and of course additional Strat help)

Then get confirmation on the rewards system from an Admin :-)

Atomicboy [The Knighthood] June 28 2011 11:16 AM EDT

I remember Jon stating that he wanted the game to become more multi minion. I think that is happening.

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] June 28 2011 11:16 AM EDT

Score isn't really a good way to judge "the top ten".

Atomicboy [The Knighthood] June 28 2011 11:18 AM EDT

I think the top is very interesting right now...

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] June 28 2011 12:15 PM EDT

Kef, if Score isn't the indicator of how well you're doing in CB, then what use is it? Well already have MPR for the most XP and PR for the most NW.

What do you use to determine the top character? (Which among other things is necessary for the N*B) Is it by Score, or by MPR?

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] June 28 2011 12:21 PM EDT

How the hell was I not in the top 10?

Bottom line is that the advantages given by xp concentration may in the long run work out some of the glaring balance issues with minion number.

moskel June 28 2011 12:23 PM EDT

I'm not in the top 10.. more often between 20-30 in score but I started with 4. My PR and MPR are around 50th and 70th respectively.

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] June 28 2011 12:23 PM EDT

Bottom line is that the advantages given by xp concentration may in the long run work out some of the glaring balance issues with minion number.

this was basically where I was going with that statement GL.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] June 28 2011 12:26 PM EDT

XP concentration as a benefit is a thing of the past.

You can copy it quite successfully on multi minion teams, and then get the added benefit of using a Tattoo and a TSA. PL and Leadership.

Oh and AS.

Nov, maybe I was just lucky and when I looked at the top 10, you'd just slipped out due to inactivity? ;)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] June 28 2011 12:28 PM EDT

You're back in there now Nov, so is Nat. So it's 7/10 of the top 10 as 4 minion teams.

With one 1, one 2 and one 3 minion teams. ;)

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] June 28 2011 12:31 PM EDT

XP concentration as a benefit is a thing of the past.

XP concentration is actually the wave of the future. Currently there's a couple teams being built that no multi minion team right now will even be able to touch.

You can copy it quite successfully on multi minion teams, and then get > the added benefit of using a Tattoo and a TSA. PL and Leadership.

You could, but currently none are. It's MUCH easier starting single minion and hiring when you need too.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] June 28 2011 12:35 PM EDT

XP concentration is actually the wave of the future. Currently there's a couple teams being built that no multi minion team right now will even be able to touch.

Ohh. Interesting! Who?

Kefeck [Demonic Serenity] June 28 2011 12:40 PM EDT

Ohh. Interesting! Who?

Novice -

http://www.carnageblender.com/inspect_opponent.tcl?opponent_id=136529

Zenai -

http://www.carnageblender.com/inspect_opponent.tcl?opponent_id=131047

shadowsparkle -

http://www.carnageblender.com/inspect_opponent.tcl?opponent_id=439

me! xD

http://www.carnageblender.com/inspect_opponent.tcl?opponent_id=122111

Basically in the long run. It'd be really wise to keep an eye on these 1-2 minion teams :)

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] June 28 2011 12:46 PM EDT

Ah! Apologies! Didn't know you had picked up Team Rocket from Nat. ;)

Quyen June 28 2011 12:47 PM EDT

hmm... if Novice now gets another 3 minions, will he destroy us? :)

Zenai June 28 2011 12:48 PM EDT

Well not to sound conceited but The 2 top SMs in the game, Novice and myself, are probably amongst those teams Kefeck is talking about. If he and I hired right now we would get a fairly good MPR bump. To go with it Nov and I are pretty tough as is can you image if multiple minions were purchased?

Zenai June 28 2011 1:05 PM EDT

Wow totally pwned! Gah I need to stop trying to post by phone......lol

QBJohnnywas June 28 2011 1:47 PM EDT

XP concentrated in one damage dealer supported by kill slots has almost always been the FTW team, right back in the CB1 days. I always loved single minion teams, but a single minion team with three kill slots works so much better...

AdminNemesia [Demonic Serenity] June 28 2011 2:53 PM EDT

The thing about single minion teams with 3 kill slots is unless they use RoE regularly they kill their own effectiveness over time.

horseguy001 [Battle Royale] June 28 2011 3:30 PM EDT

Exp concentration is good, but I just don't see the benefit on single minions. They have to train HP, and will spells like decay and GA around, that will get only get them so far. If one doesn't kill them the other will.

If Nov or Zen added 3 minions they would crush everything in CB.

AdminNemesia [Demonic Serenity] June 28 2011 3:35 PM EDT

I laugh in the face of both decay and GA.

horseguy001 [Battle Royale] June 28 2011 3:39 PM EDT

We'll see if that big FB can dish out 35 mil HP in damage over 5 rounds, since I don't see it getting by the 6th :)

Underage Drinking June 28 2011 3:57 PM EDT

Top 10 Score is fine, but broaden the scope to Top 25(which I'm 25th ;P) 15 of those 25 are 4 minion teams.

Xp concentration has always been a characters staple for success with any given strategy. I personally bought 3 of my 4 minions for db, spending well over 70million. Im by no means top shelf material, more of the hard to find good stuff.

Xenogard [Chaotic Serenity] June 28 2011 4:06 PM EDT

^ I honestly do not agree with that statement. Even if both Nov and Zen were to buy the most expensive minions possible for them, they would in the long run get nothing more then a mild bump in MPR and a couple kill slots.

First off the cost of those towards the top MPR spectrum buying that many minions is cost prohibitive at that point, sure you could hire 3 minions or put $300m+ into gear instead. And even if they were to hire, the actual XP and Stat levels on these minions would be so low, that it would barely make any difference at all. Sure it might turn the tides of some battles, but for the most part I highly doubt they'd change very much.

Multi-minion teams are good when they have a specific goal in mind, but they suck horribly if you can find their weakness and exploit it or they were leveled with no thought into the XP concentrations.

Basically the way I personally see it single minion teams are just huge powerhouses going for massive damage quickly and having a fair amount of hp. Multi-minion teams are about having a specific/general strategy in mind.

One is more flexible and easy to adapt, the other is a strong powerhouse and given enough NW could almost be juggernauts.

I think each has its place, it all comes down to what you want to run.

Xenogard [Chaotic Serenity] June 28 2011 4:13 PM EDT

Sorry my last post was in reference to this statement by horseguy

If Nov or Zen added 3 minions they would crush everything in CB.

It took me forever to type that out and a few people replied before I finished lol

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] June 28 2011 4:17 PM EDT

Those kill slots would eliminate everyone currently beating me depending on item setup, and likely give me enough leeway I could use an RoE if I chose to.

QBJohnnywas June 28 2011 4:31 PM EDT

The view that adding kill slots to a single minion reduces how effective your team runs and grows is not entirely true. The big minion grows more slowly yes, but it's not as weakening as you may think.

My team's tank is about 80% of my total MPR. This past year and a half I've had a lot less playing than I could have had due to comp downtime and work getting in the way. I've not upgraded any equipment or weapons for nearly two years apart from putting 3 mill into my bow this week. And yet I can still take on chars with over a mill more MPR and I haven't really fallen in the standings at all.

(If there were more new teams - NUB/NCB rising up through the ranks it might be different, but right now it's actually increased my teams effectiveness over the longer term rather than decreased.)

QBRanger June 28 2011 5:48 PM EDT

Those kill slots would eliminate everyone currently beating me depending on item setup, and likely give me enough leeway I could use an RoE if I chose to.

I would disagree.

One main problem you currently have are ROS characters with their massive AS/GA damage axis.

I think even if you put all the new xp into DM you would win. Kill slot do not matter vs GA.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] June 28 2011 6:03 PM EDT

Without some assistance there is only one char capable of GA'ing me to death

Xenogard [Chaotic Serenity] June 28 2011 6:09 PM EDT

The only thing I can think of you doing Novice would be doing 3 amf kill slots, 3 full hp kill slots, or a mix of the two. Neither of which would change all that much IMO. There aren't any real changes other then that which I see could possibly net you the wins vs who beats you.

AdminQBnovice [Cult of the Valaraukar] June 28 2011 6:16 PM EDT

Having 20 HP minions to avoid decay would sure help...

King June 28 2011 6:17 PM EDT

Multi-minion teams do tend to have a bit of an edge, if not in killslots, in flexibility of their equipment.

If a single minion chooses to wear a tattoo they lose out on 2 armour slots. Not wearing a cloak might not be a big deal but body armour tends to be the best source of AC, bonuses or the only source of HP regen. Depending on the type of tattoo used they also tend to lose out on the added hp and damage of a familiar.

Xenogard [Chaotic Serenity] June 28 2011 6:31 PM EDT

I see very easy ways around 20 hp minions if decay is what you are worried about.

Zenai June 28 2011 6:38 PM EDT

Extra minions can equal more flexibility in strategy if properly thought out and implemented.

horseguy001 [Battle Royale] June 28 2011 7:36 PM EDT

I think a better route would be giving nov a dedicated familiar holder with the full benefits of junction, and getting a massive injection of NW on the big minion. Big TSA, and all the stat boosting gear you could get.

Would make decay utterly useless against the team, since you would have most teams dead by the time they worked through to the big minion.

Underage Drinking June 28 2011 7:42 PM EDT

I think a better route would be giving nov a dedicated familiar holder with the full benefits of junction, and getting a massive injection of NW on the big minion. Big TSA, and all the stat boosting gear you could get.

Would make decay utterly useless against the team, since you would have most teams dead by the time they worked through to the big minion.


If I ever make it to melee against Nov Ill let you know how well Ive capitolized on a 20hp base Decay kill slot. Dont wait for me. Like Xeno said there is more than one way to get around or even eliminate that problem.

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