About drops (in General)


QBRanger January 9 2012 9:16 PM EST

It has been at least a year since drops have been instituted in CB.

At a cost of 20% of monetary rewards.

Who likes the drops and who wants no drops with restored rewards?

I want my money. Not a freaking Katana or ToE that I will never use and can get less than 50k for.

Thoughts?

Gohan [Ka-Tet of the Serene] January 9 2012 9:18 PM EST

I agree with Ranger here. The 20% would be much nicer, realistically the market is already flooded with rares.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 9:24 PM EST

We don't need more money, we just need less items. If anything just get rid of drops and don't re-increase the rewards.

Gohan [Ka-Tet of the Serene] January 9 2012 9:25 PM EST

Why would you not re-increase the rewards?

AdminTitan January 9 2012 9:29 PM EST

It's not needed. Why would *you* re-increase the rewards?

Gohan [Ka-Tet of the Serene] January 9 2012 9:31 PM EST

It just makes sense I suppose. The drop system was implemented to give people, overall, a higher reward for getting a rare drop. At this point, rares can hardly be considered rare. Give players back the guaranteed money, rather then hoping for a Corn +8 to DE.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 9:38 PM EST

But, players don't need the money, there's already vast amounts of money in CB as is. And increasing rewards by 20% would just make NUB sellouts even more tempting.

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] January 9 2012 9:40 PM EST

hmm, more money all around or more items at the bottom? i still have to go with more items at the bottom.

QBOddBird January 9 2012 10:10 PM EST

I'd rather have the rewards back. I don't make the 20% lost back in drops, and that was net profit after purchasing all BA for the day that was lost - BA purchase price didn't decrease correspondingly.

"Why do we need more money?"

Obvious answer is obvious

Underage Drinking [Battle Royale] January 9 2012 10:12 PM EST

We don't need more money. What we need are more black market tokens to spawn desired items. Like S.Y and T.A items.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:34 PM EST

"Why do we need more money?"

Obvious answer is obvious

If it's so obvious why don't you lay it out for us simpletons.

QBRanger January 9 2012 10:36 PM EST

It's not needed. Why would *you* re-increase the rewards?

For all the non-USD players who have suffered on the drop system.

Why?

I remember when the drop system was enacted. Prices of rares have certainly dropped since then. So things are certainly not equaled out given most people sell their drops.

Most of the time in CB the developers run the game towards USD players. Yes, I have been a lot of the problem. But the developers try to balance things to a large degree with things like NW-PR, and ENC.

This is one case where I believe the developers overcompensated. A case of unintended consequences.

Right now I see this mostly benefiting USD players.

But hey, it is just my thoughts on the matter. If NS or another developer wishes to read this thread and view our posts, great.

Goku January 9 2012 10:38 PM EST

Titam the obvious he's pointing to is NCB. why not increase cash for all non NUBs

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:39 PM EST

For all the non-USD players who have suffered on the drop system.

It's no different then the previous system, there's just less liquid cash. It literally affected the USD benefit to a practically negligible amount.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:39 PM EST

Titam the obvious he's pointing to is NCB. why not increase cash for all non NUBs

We don't need more incentive to multi and sell out.

Gohan [Ka-Tet of the Serene] January 9 2012 10:41 PM EST

Goku, It's about increasing base rewards. The N*B is simply a bonus to the base. I believe it would be beneficial to remove the drop system, realistically the only thing its currently good for is base tattoos. If we were to give back the 20% rewards, and possibly make the BM votes to 2 a week, based on say, renewing your ability to vote during exp time or something, it would keep base tattoos relevant and then also increase the price of rares, eventually, thus helping the overall market.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:44 PM EST

If we were to give back the 20% rewards, and possibly make the BM votes to 2 a week, based on say, renewing your ability to vote during exp time or something, it would keep base tattoos relevant and then also increase the price of rares, eventually, thus helping the overall market.

How does make rares less rare help the market? I mean I know we missed that window a long time ago; but still....

QBRanger January 9 2012 10:45 PM EST

there's just less liquid cash.

However there are certain fixed costs. Such as blacksmith, bought BA, and character transfer costs. And Mr. C artificially inflates prices in auctions.

Less CB = less ability to buy BA and upgrade equipment. Compared to USD players who buy a million or 2 to keep up.

Gohan [Ka-Tet of the Serene] January 9 2012 10:46 PM EST

Even increasing votes to 2 a week will not allow rares to be spawned in the BM, it would basically only increase the amount of tattoos spawned. 173 votes for rare weapons, and 122 for rare armor is far out of reach for the current player base. We struggle to get 48 for a tattoo.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:47 PM EST

There are not fixed costs as well since then the relative price of rares have went down like 90%; base tattoos up until maybe recently have been the price of dirt, and the only reason they have went up recently is that people have a ton of money and that no one wants to sell b/c they're near worthless.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:48 PM EST

Even increasing votes to 2 a week will not allow rares to be spawned in the BM, it would basically only increase the amount of tattoos spawned. 173 votes for rare weapons, and 122 for rare armor is far out of reach for the current player base. We struggle to get 48 for a tattoo.

We don't need to spawn tattoos, not even yet, there's still tons, maybe 5 months later if people keep flipping their tats back and forth.

Gohan [Ka-Tet of the Serene] January 9 2012 10:49 PM EST

So remove the BM, increase the rewards, and nix the drop system. More money in the game, no more rares spawned into it either, I don't see how eventually we would not get back to the point of rares being rare.

QBRanger January 9 2012 10:50 PM EST

Compared to the rares, the cost of bought BA and blacksmith upgrades are much much greater.

And most characters already have all the rares they need, except for base tattoos.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 10:55 PM EST

no more rares spawned into it either,

That would be interesting; but would be unfair to new players b/c it'd be near impossible for them to get rares, while the other 80% of the population already has them.

I think it'd be cool just to introduce new items that were actually rare and useful, like truly rare.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 11:02 PM EST

Just as an aside, I can't see an effective way of doing the above without giving some insane natural advantage to USD players. But, it'd still make the game more like a game I wanted to play, working to own a weapon that only a few people in the game owned. Or an amazing and unique piece of armor that only me and another person had.

TH3 C0113CT0R January 9 2012 11:03 PM EST

not to mention i went almost 2 months between drops once, that's a ton of money i could have used, or even if i got a drop a little bit more money. you took %20 but gave a very small chance to get a crappy item doesn't seem right. a katana or exec sword.. useless..

I would much rather get more money, or get better drops more often. i dont' care for the BM as i never have enough money to outbid the big guys if i really wanted the item anyway.

Admiralkiller January 9 2012 11:04 PM EST

I have always thought this was implemented as a cash sink. The drops are kind of neat and I have on more then one occasion seen a new player become excited about it.

My suggestion. Keep the 20% loss of income and take all the drops away except for those with NUB.

In my opinion the game would not benefit from more items nor more money.

AdminTitan January 9 2012 11:05 PM EST

My suggestion. Keep the 20% loss of income and take all the drops away except for those with NUB.

That's an interesting idea.

QBBast [Hidden Agenda] January 9 2012 11:20 PM EST


I like 'em.

Mikel January 9 2012 11:56 PM EST

I'd rather leave the drops for NUBs and get the 20% back for everyone else.
This would help people run more NCB's as rares are not as hard to come by as they used to bed with this current system. People are selling base items to the stores because no one will buy them in auctions etc.

Windwalker January 10 2012 12:00 AM EST

Who doesn't like more cash?
I'll make it rain up in here.

Lord Bob January 10 2012 12:02 AM EST

We don't need more money,
Well, I do.

I'm in favor of killing the drops and restoring our 20% cash. If anyone finds themselves with an unnecessary surplus afterwards, I'll be happy to take a donation.

Antonya [Serenity In Chaos] January 10 2012 12:42 AM EST

Sounds to me like the game is simply flooded. I say NUBs remain capable of receiving drops, the 20% remains out of the picture, and that everyone have some ice cream.

DoS [Demon Forging] January 10 2012 1:00 AM EST

We don't need more incentive to multi and sell out.

Woops, posted that on my admin account. That should have been said from this one!

{cb2}Dinh January 10 2012 2:44 AM EST

This change was stupid...granted, at first it seemed cool to almost everyone, including myself... basically because it was a "change" and any change at all these days seems to be friggin sweet because, well, it's a rarity it seems in CB anymore...

So we give everyone the "chance" to get a drop by simply doing what we always do, at the cost of 20% of ALL the money we can potentially make... It makes no sense whatsoever, considering most of these "drops" are eanything BUT rare, and most can be obtained through much, MUCH simpler means, whether it be from another player or auctions...

Oh wait, I forgot...we aren't even talking about only "rares" here, sometimes we are talking base Katana's (are you serious??) Let's just say you make $10,000,000 a month fighting, and you get one katana.... Oh how good it feels to practically 'pay' two million dollars for a damn Katana...I'd have to give someone money to get them to take this stupid item...

And who exactly is this "change" supposed to excite?? New players?? The same 'new' players who makes %500 percent more money than the veterans and dedicated players who actually give their hard earned money to this game to keep it going? Is this a joke???

This seems like a change that is actually supposed to bring this game to an end...

When all is said and done, this thread isn't even about drops... It's a call for change! We need "owners" and "developers" who want to actually see this game thrive, and if you don't want to see this game thrive, and I just don't see that, and it's obvious...

This game is so complex, with all of the numbers and raio crunching, that it demands changes and constant tweaking.... We have people in this game who could make a living computing the amount of data that they configure and come up with, that the owners of this game should be PAYING THEM TO DO SO!!! And what do they get?? A change where they lose %20 of the money the make in-game?

I don't know why in the hell it seems that any change in this game must be a PERMANENT change...Give some of these people who ALREADY do all the work for you, the power to change certain things, and we can use the poll system to tweak the changes as WE THE PLAYERS deem fitting... And if that is too much to ask, then sell the damn game to people who actually give a flatus about it so we can continue to grow this game, so WE can continue to play it and contribute to it, because we have the right to do so... Bring democracy to CB, and my half-drunken rant is over ;)

Simple fix: Change the "drops" to "supporter Items" only and quit catering to the NUBs who eventually just sell all their crap and quit anyway...

{cb2}Dinh January 10 2012 2:51 AM EST

BTW, I would like an "Admin" account too

Jecht January 10 2012 3:15 AM EST

I don't like the fact that it's not fair with everyone. Some gets lots goods and others get none. Also, even if you fight at 100% challenge bonus, it does not change your chances of getting a drop.

Admiralkiller January 10 2012 3:47 AM EST

-20% is for everyone. So it actually gives no one an advantage or disadvantage.

I just wish Jon had made the cash deduction and Rare drops a seperate issue.

I guess an alternate suggestion would be a re....hmm re something...forget the word..Ya know where everyone losses a % of something. and we all have equally less?

Jecht January 10 2012 4:07 AM EST

Well I fell it's like going to a casino. 1 or 2 will win big, while most will lose more.


Like if at your job, they decide to reduce your salary by 20%, but give you a chance to win at the end of the month an item between, plasma TV, an Ipad, a CD, a pencil, an agenda, a toothbrush,etc.

I don't see who would accept that, but if they do. After 6 month, maybe someone will have won 3 CD, 2 pencil and 1 toothbrush, while another employee will have won 6 TV.

And we all know you don't need 6 TV so he will sell some, but the others are not stupid, they know he can't sell it at over priced, cause then they just have buy it from a store or just wait and hope he get lucky too.

In the end, everyone is at loss.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] January 10 2012 4:27 AM EST

I've said since it's inception, that the drop system is a poor idea and badly designed.

CB isn't a RPG based on gear for progression (unlike for example WoW or Estia or the like), you get the single peice per slot your need for your build and that's it.

Also, the drops aren't frequent enough for people to care about. Oh, I got my first drop after three months. Whee!

Add to that a significant portion of the drops just aren't useful or interesting, and you have a system that's broing and of no real worth.

If it was decided that there is too much CBD in the game, and this is from fight rewards, then i'd be happy with not reinstating the 20% reduction to rewards, if the *stupid* NCB BA cost increase is scrapped.

Otherwise, strangling CBD generation for non USD players just pushes them down the patch of spending USD. Which would actually *increase* the incentive for others to multi and sellout.

You don't Multi and sellout on a NCB, you make another NUB to do so. ;)

I ask a question, that I've asked before.

What purpose was the drop system supposed to serve?

It's not relevant. It's not exciting. And it sure as anything doesn't compensate players for the 20% reduction (which was only put in place becuase of the drop system, it wasn't the other way around)

So what is it here for?

Now, there have been suggestions to make it relevant, and exciting. Like dropping Black Market Tokens, and letting them do other things.


But as it stand? Either change it, or get rid of it...

Gandalf January 10 2012 4:27 AM EST

I'm all for more money, but that is just me.

King January 10 2012 5:21 AM EST

I thought it was stated the 20% loss of monetary rewards was going to occur regardless of whether the drop system was kept or not.

CB2 is currently in it's 7th year and the lack of cash sinks has left the CBD - USD exchange rather worthless because too many liquid assets are floating around.

I could care less about the drops system but I'm against increasing rewards to the old standard.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] January 10 2012 6:00 AM EST

Half of all rares will now be granted as rewards in battle, in addition to cash and XP.

(That is why cash rewards have been decreased a little.)

From Jon's changelog post introducing the drop system.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] January 10 2012 6:03 AM EST

And to why there might be too much money coming in.

The strangeness that is CBs rewards system.

The larger you are, the larger reward you get.

This can only mean that as time goes on, more and more rewards will be generated and coming into CB.

And a flat percentage reduction overall will just stave off the problem temporarily, and not fix the issue.

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] January 10 2012 6:05 AM EST

Oh for an edit button...

This major problem was masked somewhat in CB1, due to increasing XP costs and increasing weapon X.

But with CB2, we have a flat XP cost, and flat weapon X.

So there's nothing in game that ramps up costs to cover increasing rewards...

Admindudemus [jabberwocky] January 10 2012 7:43 AM EST

to expand upon my earlier post: the more money we have all around would mean that there would be more money available for people to sell off as usd. not all of it would be sold, but some of it would make its way to the usd market eventually from sellouts or quitters.

the less base items we have means that the price will go up. item hoarders will reappear and, at least some, of the extra money new players have would be eaten up by the increase in item costs.

one effect of this request then is a shifting of at least some of the funds from new players to hoarders and usd spenders. i am against it for this reason.

AdminTitan January 10 2012 11:00 PM EST

"We have people in this game who could make a living computing the amount of data that they configure and come up with, that the owners of this game should be PAYING THEM TO DO SO!!!"

Lord Bob January 11 2012 12:58 AM EST

the more money we have all around would mean that there would be more money available for people to sell off as usd.
I don't see this as a problem.

the less base items we have means that the price will go up.
I see this as a good thing.

..the extra money new players have would be eaten up by the increase in item costs.
I see this as a very good thing.

Admiralkiller January 11 2012 1:13 AM EST

The thing about rares dropping is I am pretty sure it's based on a % system, and after 1 million fights we will all end up with the same or very close to the same amount of each item. So even tho on a short term system 1 person may get lucky. Over a long period we should all be roughly the same.

Mikel February 1 2012 9:01 AM EST

Woohoo one item for the whole month of January.

I prefer the cash bouns back thanks!

AdminQBGentlemanLoser [{END}] February 1 2012 11:04 AM EST

I got two!

An ES I'll never use, and a base ToE when I'm running a RoBF strat.

I'd also like the cash back please. ;)

j'bob February 1 2012 11:31 AM EST

What is this "drop" stuff you're all talking about?!?!

He he, I've never seen one. I mean before either. I mean one of my own. I've seen yours. You DROPS. Sheesh. Dirty ob!

Admiralkiller February 1 2012 3:00 PM EST

I say no drops and no money. I also say introduce a king that tax's people to fight also, since new taxes the medic charges have to go up too, also take away money time.

stabilo February 1 2012 4:01 PM EST

Actually i like the drops .. i was quite happy when i got my first drop today ;)

(and btw. for me it feels that i earn much more money than in the earlier days .. not sure, but maybe there was some changemonth that increased the fight-rewards? maybe the challenge-bonus?)

Sickone February 1 2012 5:43 PM EST

I never really liked the idea of a drop system and quite frankly it needs to go put itself out of its own misery.
Give me an opt-out of it the very least (disable chance for drop, restored CB$ reward).

Also, yes, there might be a lot of CB$ in the game itself, but it's not exactly evenly distributed, and the fact you can trade cash for it... well... no more comments.

Guardian February 1 2012 6:24 PM EST

i'm 2 months with no drops.
get ride of this failed system. I want more money to buy ba or to blacksmith my stuff.

stabilo February 2 2012 7:02 AM EST

Or maybe improve it that it not only drops items randomly, but also forges randomly one of your items for one more x or +.

like:

From: system (March 1 11:44 PM EST)
Dwarf is pleased with your victory and forges your An Amulet of Might [0] (+15) to [0] (+16). Use it well!

.. this way it could be millions if you are luky and it improves your +200 DB's ;)

stabilo February 2 2012 7:05 AM EST

oh yes, and actually this would force us to not keep things around we don't need or upgrade .. or pay someone else to keep your base-items ;)
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