Would you voluntarily enter the CB lottery? (in General)
June 15 2009 3:32 PM EDT
In another thread Sut asked a nice question.
Given an opt out option, would you opt in or out of the recent change.
That is 20% less cash rewards for a chance to get drops.
Please 1 reply per person, stating yes or no.
Yes being that you WOULD enter such a lotto/lottery.
No being you want your guaranteed rewards and would not want random drops.
And if yes or no, a brief explanation as to why.
I really would like both new and old player to post to get a general feeling on this change.
My answer is obvious. A huge NO.
June 15 2009 3:33 PM EDT
I definitely wouldn't enter the lottery since cash is preferred over items that I don't want.
No. I've now fought so many battles, that unless my lotto drop (assuming I get one) sells for over 2m, I'll be eating a loss.
June 15 2009 3:35 PM EDT
I have yet to get a drop, and all the money lost isn't very fun.
June 15 2009 3:36 PM EDT
No because I have always liked having a for sure amount of cash achievable in each battle. With the current system, some people are luckier than others and have gotten a few drops compared to the others that have gotten multiple. I have an idea on how it could be changed to better suit everyone more fairly but that isn't for this topic.
I would make some effort to determine which way would give overall better rewards then decide ;)
I would probably fail then go lottery as I like to gamble and don't care much either way.
June 15 2009 3:38 PM EDT
can you please state how many drops you have gotten when answering?
I have gotten only 1, EGs.
And from now on, please 1 post per person to keep the thread sort of clean.
June 15 2009 3:38 PM EDT
I would not willingly give up 20% of my cash.
June 15 2009 3:39 PM EDT
Although getting an item (I received an AoJ)is nice. I think the twenty percent is too high. Maybe cut it in half. With the cut in rewards it does not leave a lot of wiggle room for tank characters. NO as is.
June 15 2009 3:39 PM EDT
No drops, sorry. I was posting when you typed that.
June 15 2009 3:40 PM EDT
I would vote yes. Mostly because I am a gambling man at heart, and by the looks of it, most would opt out. Thus increasing my chances of winning an item.
I have won zero drops so far.
June 15 2009 3:41 PM EDT
If being given the choice, I would not join.
June 15 2009 3:43 PM EDT
I have gotten nothing so far.
And Yes! I would like such a lottery since the feeling that "next fight might give me an item!!" is almost addicting =)
I would enter the lottery. I like it, probably because I'm not running for the top. But I would NOT enter if the drop tables continue to include stupid crap like Katanas, GoMs...you see where I'm going. Some items should not be rares.
June 15 2009 3:58 PM EDT
I would not enter this "lottery". And I have received zero drops.
I'd rather not be a part of it. Having the cash gives us options.
I didn't read ranger's second post.
I received FF and ES already, but I don't care if it's a cornuthaum, I still dislike this system.
June 15 2009 4:13 PM EDT
Yes, I would enter.
June 15 2009 4:16 PM EDT
Yes I would. I believe I said something similar, as well, in another thread involving options for a poll :P
June 15 2009 4:16 PM EDT
no lottery for me please..
no drops yet.. im sure they will come, but i would like the cash over the drops
June 15 2009 4:18 PM EDT
NO, I would have not willingly entered this item lottery.
I would have not entered it willingly even if I was assured the rewards were fair (in other words, if I sold all I got I would make back all cash on average) because it's a total drag to have a cluttered inventory, fill the FS forum or take your chances with the auction system (usually, what a surprise, Mr. Chairman would end up buying my stuff).
But since it's obvious that overall I actually lose money... a huge, resounding NO.
I would join this lottery voluntarily if the reduction of money was reduced to being a 10% penalty instead of this 20% we are experiencing now.
I have received no items yet.
June 15 2009 4:31 PM EDT
I've got two items so far: AoJ, and Gloves of Mercy [sell to store 27k].
June 15 2009 4:32 PM EDT
I have received an AoJ and an Enforcer's xbow so far.
June 15 2009 4:36 PM EDT
Shield of Capacity and a Lesser EF.
(SoC is in use on my char, lesser EF is sitting on my bank char. Not quite sure where that leaves me financially.)
June 15 2009 4:39 PM EDT
No...want the money i was making instead. Received a lesser ToA
so far i have received an aoj and an elven stiletto.
June 15 2009 4:41 PM EDT
No. Zero drops.
Sorry for the double post, but no, I haven't received any drops, but I would still opt in.
No. I've read numerous times in these forums that a character is disposable. I wanted to create a NCB and the reduction in cash rewards will definitely set me back.
Yes, but my opinion means squat when im forging
Haven't gotten any drops yet.
June 15 2009 6:45 PM EDT
No. I had hoped to run a Solo Archer team after this NCB but this lottery is making that look like a pipe dream.
June 15 2009 6:48 PM EDT
No, I would not voluntarily enter the lottery because it is a horrible change to a good game.
I have gotten 1x ToA and 1x Hal Fam and still would say no even though I have gotten 2 more items then some people.
Let me reduce my thoughts to one sentence:
''Randomness should be a plus, not a hindrance to predictability.''
CB is a strategy game. Drops do add a little excitement, but should not happen to skew what is predictable in it: Rewards.
So, drops should happen with a very low percentage. With very low reward cuts to go with em.
June 15 2009 6:57 PM EDT
I prefer to do other things with my money. And if there is something I want, then I would rather have control over seeking it out and getting it (as opposed to fighting a lot and hoping I find it). As for selling a drop I don't like hoping that if and when I do get a "drop" the market is posed for a profitable sale of said drop.
June 15 2009 7:07 PM EDT
Yes, but does Buddy Lee prefer drops? Or IS this Buddy Lee speaking?
June 15 2009 7:09 PM EDT
j'bob is merely the mouth piece of Buddy Lee. Whatever is said you must believe that it has been cleared by the will of the Man of Action!!!!
June 15 2009 7:09 PM EDT
I want my, I want my CBd
June 15 2009 7:12 PM EDT
This question is a little well.. silly. The reason most people are upset is because of the disproportionate drop in cash.. not the randomness. If you reduce rewards, of course people are going to be unhappy.
It's like asking someone if they like that the economic collapse.
June 15 2009 7:14 PM EDT
Please answer the question. Or get out of the thread.
If you do not like the Q, move on.
But Jon reduced the cash to compensate for the drops. Overall he feels it should even out in the long run. Less cash for more rares, which you can use or sell.
June 15 2009 7:19 PM EDT
NO. I'm with you Ranger.
I don't mind the drops, but reducing cash rewards by 20%? Heck no, give me back my cash! And to further reduce it for more drops? No, once again, gimme my cash!
I have only received a Helm of Ecthelion (+4).
June 15 2009 7:21 PM EDT
Harsh; I venture in one post providing my answer and get a response to get out.
As I was trying to say, if rewards and cash were balanced better, it'd be easier for people to get on board. But I see you don't like anything but a yes or no.
They're either wit' us or again' us!
And you were just priding the last thread on being very civil...
June 15 2009 7:23 PM EDT
C'mon, Ranger, Cube's point is valid (though Cube, wouldn't help to answer the question, too. *smile*)
I agree, we can keep this thread just as civil as the other!
June 15 2009 7:25 PM EDT
Let us say, as it is NOW, the rewards are balanced.
Some are ahead like Sox, others are equal like me, and others are behind with no drops.
So with that what is your answer.
Sry if I was nasty before.
June 15 2009 7:25 PM EDT
Reason: I perceive the change as disproportionate.
June 15 2009 7:27 PM EDT
Even if it is perfectly balanced, no because there's no point taking a Zero sum risk. Yep, I am someone who can't have any fun in a casino without poker.
June 15 2009 7:28 PM EDT
I share The R in Poutine opinion on this.
So no I would not like to enter such a lottery.
So far I won a lesser tatoo of endurance and made a wicked profit of 2000CBD with it to the store.
June 15 2009 8:27 PM EDT
however I'd like to be able to play it on a weekly basis and opt out on a weekly basis if I want to.
June 15 2009 8:32 PM EDT
If he brought the money rewards back and still allowed us to have drops then I'd say yes. Otherwise it's a no.
Yes, but only because for every person that doesn't participate, the chance of getting a drop would go up, since not everybody would be in on the lottery.
But since I'm a forger, it is pointless anyways...
Yes, and here's why:
If you had to opt for either more cash or a chance at rare drops, a lot of people would just go cash. That still leaves 50% of the game rares entering through drops, but to much less people.
June 15 2009 9:14 PM EDT
because i hold t3h lottery contests.
June 15 2009 9:34 PM EDT
Vaynard, if it became optional, I assure you the parameters of how things worked would change...
CB does not give a free lunch. Feel free to repeat it after me. CB does not give a free lunch.
June 15 2009 9:40 PM EDT
I am sure that those who opt in and out in such a system will have the same net cash inflow.
June 15 2009 9:49 PM EDT
Folks need to understand -- THIS IS A ZERO-NET PHENOMENON.
It always has been, always will be. All you get to choose (if even that) is how it is distributed.
Right now it is distributed in large, highly-varied, unplannable chunks. If you like that, fine. But if you can, please explain to me why that adds value to your sense of "fun".
And before you use the word "gamble", please recall there are literally hundreds of Flash apps that will let you play free, meaningless slot machine simulators.
At it's best, that is what the drop system is.
My opinion on drops is simple to explain.
Items are more fun than CBD, hence why I think they are ''exciting''. Now, I know some people love and NEED their rewards to be calculable and predictable. Which is fine. So, again I say rewards should be cut by a tiny amount and drops should be super-rare. Keep the change, but make it less apparent.
June 15 2009 10:19 PM EDT
I don't disagree with you, french-fries-and-gravy (almost made it).
But even that trivializes the whole thing... Why have some rare pop-out when just having the cash would let you simply BUY the damn thing? This whole lotto-drop idea is artificially mystifying something _banal_.
You can dress up a 260-pound butcher-hog in lace, ribbons, and fine silk all you want. But I'll still just be wondering, "Where's the bacon?"
And once I get the bacon, it'll taste just the same. Even Steven, again.
i guess some of us would go out for a night on the town with the pig and have a wonderful time and still enjoy the bacon too. ;)
June 15 2009 10:41 PM EDT
dudemus, you know I love ya, but if everything is just peachy and rosy all the time, then god bless, I guess. What else can I say?
I say yes.
Jon perhaps should have just made the 20% less money and the drop prize a separate thing. Really we all make 20% cash so it's not like anyone gets an advantage. Random also has a way of making everything even and eventually it will.
So IMO I view it as two separate things and just accept it.
Jon never seems to give in to peoples complaints either so to me it's part of the game and is not going to change anytime soon. For me this issue is over.
June 15 2009 11:08 PM EDT
I think Jon should just lower the cost of BA by 20%, and it will make everything equal and balanced again. Sound Good?
June 15 2009 11:20 PM EDT
i like it.
Plain and simple, just like my suggestions.
but who listens?
June 15 2009 11:40 PM EDT
WoC, almost there:
-- Lower BA cost 20%
-- Lower minion cost 20%
-- Lower all gear upgrade costs 20% (BA only, I guess, since forgers still have the same yield).
In other words, anything that costs cash in the game needs to be lowered 20%, too. Or at least lowered some to titrate the unpredictability (and crappy rare drops) of the new drop lottery.
Sut, wouldn't lowering the cost of all that sort of defeat the purpose of lowering the rewards to begin with? It was intended as a tradeoff, albeit maybe a bit of a harsh one. I understand a lot of people want to have the cake and eat it, but generally that's just not how it works.
June 15 2009 11:52 PM EDT
Out of curiosity, what would be the point in lowering cash rewards by 20% if every expense in the game is lowered by the same amount?
I'm getting the feeling from many that "I'll be unhappy until I receive the same thing I was before, PLUS random drops."
June 16 2009 12:08 AM EDT
Nope, I sure never asked for that. I Want drops to go away and cash to go back to the way it was.
No free lunch, and even if there were, I'd be the last guys asking for it (and likely the first to leave!)
June 16 2009 12:09 AM EDT
The changes are and should be a ZERO SUM event. Over enough time that is. For a while it will not be. It seems most will be negative until they find that drop worth 100k-millions of CB.
A few will be highly positive finding high end rares like corns, SBs, and AoJs.
And a few will be even, like myself finding occasional mid ranged items.
There should ONLY be a change if the 20% turns out to be off. And then adjusted to keep the zero sum status.
At least that is how I see things with this change.
June 16 2009 12:13 AM EDT
And yeah, GA, that is what it was _supposed_ to be. But it isn't. Half of the rares, maybe more, are worthless. Zero value. And Ranger's excellent point is that with less cash in the game, prices will only go DOWN. How can anyone every recoup the lost cash?
And for some, recouping will NEVER be timely. Look, we are already into 11-12 days and some folks have nothing. Even if they got something right now, auctioned it, it could be an even two weeks for cash (and that cash might be the paltry sum from selling an axbow, for example).
Two weeks without 20% of normal revenue. That affects things you might rent, gear you might upgrade, minion savings you were saving for, loans you were paying off, and insult to injury, the ability to buy BA -- the very thing that gets you the damn chance at a drop in the first place.
This change has taken the part of the game that responsible, forward-thinking players have used for more than 5 years (financial discipline and management) and turned it into a randomized joke (with no apparent benefits, even if you don't mind the downsides).
So, what's the point?
June 16 2009 12:20 AM EDT
OB you hit the nail on the head, everyone wants free stuff *shrugs* it is human nature.
Honestly I feel a lowering of the % taken out to 5-10% while keeping the drop rate the same is a FAIR compromise. I will, however, say that I vehemently say "NO!" to the drops being completely free.
Absolutely N-to-the-O for free drops!
Sut, I think maybe the point was to shake up a game that's become somewhat stagnant, in part. Outside of the NUB or running an NCB, fighting is pretty much a slow grind, and honestly, kind of boring at times. Having the possibility of a rare drop adds a bit of excitement.
June 16 2009 12:25 AM EDT
GA, I don't disagree. I've gotten two drops, and, well, I'm already over it. :\
Do you really think random drops add long-term appeal? (genuine question).
And as others have pointed out, fixing some issues in gameplay might also serve to make the game more appealing. PL and the exbow, depending on the day, can make me want to give up the game entirely at times.
June 16 2009 12:25 AM EDT
When you get older, you lose your regularity. I believe it's called Incontinence.
In seriousness though, the world is random and unpredictable, and I get that CB never had it, and doesn't feel like it should, but it's not all that different. To make my answer clearer, IF I had a choice I would opt out. That doesn't mean that I dislike the change, as it effects everyone evenly in the long run. This is why I disliked the question.
June 16 2009 12:27 AM EDT
Correction, Cube, CB _used_ to have it, and has subsequently had it systematically removed over the last 4 years or so.
The "it" being randomness.
You know what, screw it. Bring it all back. I want cast rates back!
Heck, bring back Finger of Death, the ultimate in chance-based gameplay!
June 16 2009 12:32 AM EDT
Okay, you've lost me by now... But I'll agree to anything blindly! Bring whatever that is back.
June 16 2009 12:34 AM EDT
Muhahahaha! Cube is my new minion!!!!!....
Crap, what should I do with _that_? *smile*
(just joking around, man, I don't even remember how all the old-school stuff worked, and truth be told, FoD was canned right before I started the game in May 2003...)
June 16 2009 12:35 AM EDT
FoD was decay before decay was decay.
% chance to kill your opponents minion.
I joined CB after it was changed to decay and perhaps someone like Sut who was in CB1 longer can explain it better for all us newer players.
June 16 2009 12:39 AM EDT
Nah, it was already canned when I got here, it was something like a 5% chance to kill ANY minion, regardless of AC, etc. It was the first of the "totally random" things to get canned.
Then there were cast rates. Used to be enchantments had a chance of not casting at all. Win, Win, Win, Win, Lose. Heck, until I whined about it, you couldn't even untrain "intrinsics" (STR/DEX/HP). See where we are now.
OK, that last one has nothing to do with randomness. Time for me to go to bed. *smile*
FOD= Finger of Death
Was upgradable the higher the % the better chance it would work.
I hated it.
However a low level character with a decent FoD could take out #1 every once in a while.
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